There’s Not Much That’s Funnier Than a Republican Confronted With Facts

I’m sure I’m not the only one who, when debating a Republican, walks away thinking, “I wonder what reality is like on their planet?”

Because some of the comments I hear coming from these people would be hilarious if they didn’t actually believe them.  Hell, sometimes I even feel sorry for them.

For instance their hero is President Reagan, someone they call a “true conservative.”  Except, they can’t tell you exactly how he was a conservative.  He quadrupled our national debt, something Republicans don’t deny.  Yet they still consider him the epitome of “Republican conservatism.”  Then again, both George H. Bush and George W. Bush grew our national debt, so if Reagan is the example of “Republican conservatism,” they followed that example perfectly.

Most sane people know that being “fiscally conservative” doesn’t mean running up giant deficits, so calling Reagan a “conservative legend” doesn’t make any sense.

Or let’s look at the recession — they actually blame it on President Obama, and the ones that don’t blame it on him say he made it worse.  Which is just about as bad as those who think he caused it, considering our job losses were cut by more than 50% 4 months after he took office.  Only in the world of Republicans can reducing job losses by more than half, quickly, be a bad thing.

Then again, an improving economy is  bad news for Republicans.  Before the election, I always liked asking them whether or not they felt GOP politicians were happy when positive economic numbers came out.  If they answered yes, knowing positive economic numbers meant it was more likely President Obama would win re-election, they were most likely lying.  If they answered no, then they were basically admitting they knew their politicians were doing anything they could to sabotage economic recovery and hurt Americans.

Pointing this out, however, often caused their brain to shut down as they couldn’t come to grips that their party was actively trying to harm the economy, which made them the bad guys.

Last year’s presidential election really brought about the most ridiculous behavior by Republicans.  Nothing quite like a party which had pushed Obama to release 2 different forms of a birth certificate, and some pushing for the release of college transcripts, then saying their presidential candidate had no obligation to show more than 2 years of his tax returns.

What made it even more ironic was that Romney’s own father was the man who set the precedent for a presidential candidate releasing multiple years worth of tax returns.  Then Republicans tried to say Obama was playing politics over tax returns, even though it was during the GOP primaries that fellow Republicans  made Romney’s tax returns an issue.  Just more proof that blaming Obama for something they created is nothing new for conservatives.

Then when the story resurfaced about Romney tying a family pet to the roof of a car, Republicans came back with Obama eating dog while he was 9 years old living in the Philippines.  They really compared a competent adult with a family to a 9 year old eating what his parents told him to eat in a foreign country.

That doesn’t even go into how Romney said he wasn’t concerned with 47% of Americans, bullied a gay classmate in high school (cutting off his hair), flip-flopped on almost every major issue or how he displayed his ignorance by praising the health care system of countries he visited who have socialized health care (something of which Republicans have fiercely opposed in the United States).  Hit them with that and you’d probably hear about the time in 2008 when Obama once accidentally said there were 57 states, when he obviously meant to say he had visited 47 of the 50 states during his campaign.

Hell, even on election night Republicans were in disbelief Obama had won.  Karl Rove sat on Fox News, making a fool of himself, refusing to say Obama had been re-elected.  He seemed in denial that his side’s efforts to buy the presidency had failed—and failed miserably.  As for conservative voters, they were most likely genuinely shocked.  After all, Fox News and other right-wing pundits had been lying to them for months about Romney’s chances.  They painted most every poll that showed Obama headed for an easy victory as “liberally biased”, so Republican voters really did believe Romney was headed for a win.

And I can’t forget the “Great Benghazi Conspiracy.”  Well, at least that’s what Republicans wished it was.  For months they’ve pushed and pushed, first hoping to get something on Obama before the election and now hoping to get something on Hillary for 2016.  Except—there’s nothing to it.  In fact, the real “conspiracy” is who edited the “leaked emails” that were initially released to try and create a story that wasn’t there.  You’re telling me that Republicans knew nothing of the emails being edited?  Sure they didn’t.  But if you point this out to a Republican they’ll paint Benghazi as an attack as bad as 9/11 and a “cover up” even more scandalous than Watergate.

No, seriously—Republicans have compared those events to Benghazi.

Honestly, I could write a 5 page dissertation covering the ridiculous statements Republicans have made when confronted with reality which contradicts what they want  to believe.

I would encourage everyone to show conservatives some of the articles I’ve written with linked sources which debunk Republican lies — Debunking Almost Every Republican Lie Against President Obama, The Article Every Liberal Needs to Show a Conservative or Part 2: The Article Every Liberal Needs to Show a Conservative.  Then watch as your right-wing friends or family members make fools out of themselves trying to make excuses for those lies.  It’s truly quite hilarious.

Allen Clifton

Allen Clifton is a native Texan who now lives in the Austin area. He has a degree in Political Science from Sam Houston State University. Allen is a co-founder of Forward Progressives and creator of the popular Right Off A Cliff column and Facebook page. Be sure to follow Allen on Twitter and Facebook, and subscribe to his channel on YouTube as well.


Facebook comments

  • Let the truth BE the truth!

  • Alethophobia: An abnormal fear of the truth

  • jerseyirish

    Roger Ailes (Faux News CEO) said it best: “The Truth Is What People Will Believe.”

    • Mister_Mean

      That is troubling.

      • Holly

        true. But he said it.

    • Var Enyo

      He and Murdoch are very canny. They can whip up a hatred of Muslims while having a Muslim partner and also co-owning a media group called Rotana that makes films that are anti-American and anti-Israeli which are the same things they accuse liberals of doing. There is money to be made in whipping up hatred. They know their minions will never look very hard at them.

    • Baaly

      Well, according to the FCC, faux news is classified as ‘satire’ and NOT a news network.

  • The “truth” and the “facts” are very subjective as they rely on the perception and interpretation on the individual.

    • jdubhub68


      • There is nothing ambiguous, misleading or false about what I said.

        An example of what I said is; say there is an old lady perhaps 85 years old and about 5’1″ tall. This lady is walking down the side walk to the store when a man In a ski mask runs up knocks her down and steals her purse. A male bystander sees the incident and calls 911 while chasing the man that stole the alderly ladies purse. The man in the ski mask drops the purse and gets away. The bystander retrieves the purse and returns it to the lady. By this time the police have arrived and are questioning the elderly woman she describe the man as a white male 6’1″ and approximately 220 pounds wearing a blue jacket and black jeans and a ski mask that was black. Upon returning the purse to the lady the police question the Samaritan. He discribes the mugger as a male, 5’10” 185 pound in a blue jacket black jeans and black ski mask. Te difference isn’t because the Samaritan or the elderly woman are lying its because they each perceive the situation and the related facts differently.

        If you want a visual example of this watch brain games they illustrate how perception skews the truth/facts of a situation.

      • jdubhub68

        That may be an interesting philosophical discussion, but that’s not how the real world operates. One cannot arbitrarily assign subjective criteria when interacting with others. For instance, I cannot arbitrarily decide my dollar bill should be worth $20 and demand $15 in change from the cashier for a five dollar purchase. I may believe that my money should be worth more, but that doesn’t mean that society has to accept my belief.

        That’s why society is set up with rules and agreements on what is and what is not. Therefore, in your philosophical tangent, your definition of “fact” does become an equivocation when you try and change the definition of what is accepted as fact.

      • The real world does operate that way watch brain games if you don’t believe me. It’s simply how the brain processes information. Here’s an example on your cash theory say you hand me a stack of $185 dollars but you give it to me in one dollar bills that’s a pretty big stack. And I hand you a small clear bag with flour in it. And a cop setting across the street in a parking lot sees the transaction what do you suppose he is going to think based on the information from what he has just seen?

      • jdubhub68

        That’s arguing from theory. Society has rules. Rules that are not open for subjective interpretation. If someone breaks those rules, there are consequences. You may believe what you wrote in those comments, but try and go into a court of law and defend breaking the law with that argument and you will lose your case and/or be held in contempt for continuing that tangent rather than discussing the facts of the case.

        In your example, the police officer would come over and look at what was in the bag. The contents would be tested–using science–to see if anything illegal–applying laws–was in the bag. The whole process would be legal–again, applying laws–under probable cause. After the bag was tested and it was determined–using science–that it just contained flour, it would not matter if ten people came by and claimed it was cocaine or heroin; science, not subjective philosophical opinion, would have decided its contents.

        Your entire line of reasoning is arguing from theory.

      • You’re off topic. Science has proven that the brain works that way and the show brain games tells you why when they demonstrate the trick for lack of a better word. It isn’t theory when science, doctors in particular can show it in practice with people.

      • jdubhub68

        Actually, the topic is “There’s Not Much That’s Funnier Than a Republican Confronted with Facts” by Allen Clifton. The article is the context for my comments. Your comments are tangential at best.

      • A republican and a democrat go to the theater and watch a movie after the movie the democrat is raving about ow good the movie was, at the same time the republican is lamenting on how horrible the movie was. Does the democrat praising the movie make it a good movie for the republican? No because in this example the truth is subjective the same thing applies to congress what democrats consider true the republicans can consider false primarily because politics and legislation work in gray areas just like the law works,in gray areas. The only thing that truly changes is the size of the gray area. Are there cases whe truth is objective? Yes you listed some. What I am saying I guess is that what democrats think is true or right or wrong or false isn’t what the republicans think and vice versa.

      • jdubhub68

        You are still arguing from theory. Did you not read Allen Clifton’s article? If you had, you would realize that it was discussing things that really happened, not talking about movies and if a person believes or disbelieves that something happened.

        Since it appears that you are unable to speak in terms of objective reality, there’s no point in continuing this thread.

      • I read it and I think it’s skewed to the left because of his bias. He conveniently omits the stupid things the Democratic Party has done that are just as asinine in order to make his position on the topic seem better its not theory when to people have differing opinions on such things as I have been mentioning its a fact that people do them daily just like its fact that the sky is blue neither are theory. Democrats are just as culpable as republicans when it come to the topic of this article so get off your horse and see that both sides do it not just one or the other.

      • Chomper Lomper Tawee

        The sky is not actually blue.

      • I don’t think you understand opinion from factual reality, therefore anything anyone tries to explain to you just goes over your head. To try to explain the difference would be a waste as you are obviously too close minded to see anything other than what you want to believe, this is a common plague among people who watch fox news.

      • He is arguing that the fact one person doesn’t like something and the other does is arguing from theory. It isn’t any les factual or true either way and it isn’t theory. If you don’t get that that’s your problem. I don’t watch Fox News or much news at all for that matter so stop making generalizations about a person you know zero about based on a few comments made by some one you don’t agree with it makes you look like an intellectual midget. It also makes you appear to be close minded.

      • You are actually off topic, the topic is facts. If the cop saw what he thinks is cocaine, he would question it, then discover that the truth/fact is that it is flour. If the lady and other man describe the mugger and have different descriptions the truth would never change, the mugger would still be the same size regardless of what they describe. Perception can affect individual belief, yet can not change the actual truth. You can perceive that President is not American if he goes to Africa and dresses in traditional African attire, yet that does not change the fact that he is an American. You can perceive that it is 40 degrees when you have a fever, but it wouldn’t change the temperature of the room. The fact would be that the temperature is the same (unless it really did change but that’s not the point).

      • Actually he strayed off topic when he proposed the legal and police scenario. My scenario with the flour was a troll sorry you fell for it.

      • Holly

        that works for subjective things, but when a fact is checkable, it goes down the drain.

      • Mayor Bloomberg recently tried to ban drinks over 16 ounces and he and presumably people in the NY state congress agreed and tried to limit the size of fountain drinks and they thought it was right and true. This is the gray area I was talking about in my post to jdub. I also stated that the truth can be both subjective and objective. The case I proposed to him was subjective. And if I said the sky is blue or that the democrats created the largest depression in US history both are objective statements.

      • Gary Smith

        “democrats created the largest depression in US history both are objective statements”

        That’s not on objective statement; that’s what’s known as a bald faced lie (no offense).

      • Apparently you don’t know much about history. The depression that started rolling in 1837 was a direct result of Andrew Jackson’s fiscal policy implementations to curb spending. It isn’t a lie its historical fact.

      • There is nothing ambiguous, misleading or false about what I said.

        An example of what I said is; say there is an old lady perhaps 85 years old and about 5’1″ tall. This lady is walking down the side walk to the store when a man In a ski mask runs up knocks her down and steals her purse. A male bystander sees the incident and calls 911 while chasing the man that stole the alderly ladies purse. The man in the ski mask drops the purse and gets away. The bystander retrieves the purse and returns it to the lady. By this time the police have arrived and are questioning the elderly woman she describe the man as a white male 6’1″ and approximately 220 pounds wearing a blue jacket and black jeans and a ski mask that was black. Upon returning the purse to the lady the police question the Samaritan. He discribes the mugger as a male, 5’10” 185 pound in a blue jacket black jeans and black ski mask. Te difference isn’t because the Samaritan or the elderly woman are lying its because they each perceive the situation and the related facts differently.

        If you want a visual example of this watch brain games they illustrate how perception skews the truth/facts of a situation.

    • Gary Smith

      Facts are not subjective. Facts are, by definition, objective. Interpretations of and extrapolations from facts can be subjective, but provable, verifiable facts never, ever are.

      • It’s a fact that I don’t like liver and onions and its also the truth that I don’t like them. Does that mean you don’t like them too? There are facts that are subjective.

      • Sk Johnson

        Not one of the scenarios you’ve presented so far constitute a factual situation. All of the examples you offer as proof to your claim are definitively and indisputably cases of a person’s opinion determining their personal preferences or making a judgment call, and therefore are exactly NOT fact. Since the definitions of the two words ‘fact’ and ‘perception’ are mutually exclusive, you can not have something that is both so this there is no gray area, period. If the words ‘like’ ‘dislike’ ‘think’ ‘believe’ ‘perceive’ ‘want’ ‘interpretation’ ‘prefer’ ‘hate’ ‘love’ or any emotion of any kind appear anywhere i the statement being made, it is indeed not a fact. Facts are determined by measurable properties held by tangible objects and can be verified by anyone at any time provided they have access to those objects. What you are describing in every example you’ve given are either personal tastes, assumptions, or emotional responses. None of those things qualify as factual.

  • ekbelladona16

    Rachel I’ve been observing the politics in the White House for many yearrrrrrs and I cannot believe the amount of thieve with wolf clothing in the White House. I want Obama to check their taxes going back yearssssss and he will see how much they been stealing from the Nation. Remember don’t let them distract you guys with the noise. That rat has a lot of dirt and we need to clean up until it turn white,we may need pure clorox. I must say you and the group were always on point. “Keep a stiff upper lip” Peace and love!

    • keesha

      What?? None of this paragraph makes any sense!

    • ZekeTX


    • Holly

      what the heck???????

  • Oh, please stop calling them “conservatives.” They are not. Call them what they are, “reactionaries.” The only conservatism in today’s GOP is social. The new fiscal conservatives are the Dems, who are no longer “liberals,” but fiscally conservative centrists. The only liberalism that remains in the Democratic party is social…but only if it doesn’t cost anything, or threaten the corporate overlords. Wake up, folks! Nobody in Washington cares about us. At all.

    • ^This guy right here gets it.

    • lockewasright

      Nobody in Washington is SUPPPOSED to care about anything but getting re-elected. Politicians with principles suck. They don’t bend to the will of the people. We want spineless weathervanes who do what we tell them because they want to keep their job. Get the money out of politics and place the blame on the voters where it belongs.

      • meg

        Some flash of cognitive dissonance made me look up your profile…a guy with what appears to be a mullet who references Locke. But as I scrolled through your comments I was taken by how insightful and funny your posts were. If you have a blog, I want to subscribe. If you don’t you ought to consider it.

    • Well lets not say nobody. I wouldn’t put Senators Warren, Sanders, and Brown in that mix.

      • Shirley Williams

        Or Rep Grayson!

      • Basil1111

        True and I will really get local and help elect local public officials like Warren and Sanders. I am seriously hoping that Warren Challenges Hilary. Enough of the Sell outs.

      • hpdonle

        I hope someone strong challenges Hillary from the Left. Warren, Sanders, Grayson, even Fiengold would be acceptable if he decides to make a comeback.Don’t get me wrong I’ll vote for Hillary if she is the nominee but I will not support her for the nomination.

      • Basil1111

        Ditto. Spread the word.

      • S.R. Smith

        Or congressman Lujan !

      • Socialmedic

        Right, the day the white middle class male overwhelmingly supports Warren I will eat my sunhat. I wish they were smart enough to vote for her, but that will NEVER happen.

    • They are fascists. They try to pass legislation to effectively put the Judicial branch under the control of Congress, they do all they can to consolidate government, religion and commerce to obtain and maintain power, through rejection of gun laws they give aid to radical militias and they insist on building ever more M1A1 Abrams tanks, even though the Pentagon doesn’t want them. What in the world do they want all those militias and tanks for? If they had produced a charismatic leader who could have beaten Obama in 2012, we might already be in a penal camp or dead.

      • Maria Andropelii

        wanna be terrorists is what they are

      • Lorrie Crabtree

        There’s no “wannabe” to it. Not when they held this nation hostage for 16 days.

      • Joyboy

        They don’t sound like they love America to me. Just the opposite, they sound like they want to hurt the US. Growing up, I was taught to love my country, not to be full of greed and only care about whether I will get re-elected. The Repubs. are making me sad and SICK!

    • frumpus

      They are authoritarian theocrats that’s what. Also you might be right about what democrats are today, but bringing that up is completely irrelevant to the point of this article, which is that republicans are fucking stupid.

    • Guy L Laraway Jr

      Yeah. Like the 1.3 billion no cost aid to africa.

      • Matt Pantages

        or the sale of arms the iran contras?

      • Maria Andropelii

        nice attempt at obfuscation. why didn’t you just shriek “birth certificate’ while you’re at it?

      • YouKnowMe

        Or teleprompters! Michelle’s hips!

    • Mister_Mean

      They are the American Taliban or as I call them the Tal-i-ban-Repub-li-cans

      • wizayn

        Tal-i-ban-Repub-li-can’ts is more like it

      • momarlon

        Talibanana Republicans

      • melloe

        I call them Tea Turds

    • Joyboy

      What would you suggest, no government at all? You have to choose from the choices you are given.

      • YouKnowMe

        That’s what the Dribbletarians want.

    • gemma liar

      I prefer the accurate term “regressives’………… and to quote saint bill o’reilly ” that’s a memo”

    • Basil1111

      I too am cynical at times. And sometimes I feel that it’s not cynicism but the awful truth.

    • johnbuoy

      They’re prostitutes, sold out to the Koch brothers, big oil and banks, and whomever else will line their pockets.

    • regressive rightwing trash

      I call them REGRESSIVES as they want to go back 2 the era of older white rightwing religious trash who had minorities and women under wraps

  • Jeanne Biles Crawford

    These republicans know exactly what they are doing, and they know exactly what the objective truth is. They are not stupid, they are not that deluded. There are millions of mostly ignorant, racist, bigoted, you name it, people out there ready to eat up the crap they are spewing because it is what they desperately want to believe. These people will believe anything and everything Faux News tells them. They don’t want to read any articles that state the truth. They want to stay in their comfort zone and they will refuse to recognize the truth, no matter how it is presented to them. But…truth will prevail. The world will look back on this time in our history as monumental. These republicans are trying to hold on to a way of life that is destined for extinction. It’s really very pathetic. Truth is truth, lies are lies, regardless of what people choose to believe. Truth will always prevail.

    • John1966

      Perfect description of liberalism.

      • Jeanne Biles Crawford

        I’m not talking about liberalism vs conservatism, or any ism vs any other ism. I’m talking about truth vs lies. I’m not talking about political ideology, I’m talking about common decency vs deceit. Decency and truth, apart from political ideologies, will prevail.

      • KEHT

        The truth is very subjective, especially when you start asking whether we are “better off now than four years ago” 🙂

      • Jeanne Biles Crawford

        Okay, lets say facts vs fabrications then. “Better off” is definitely subjective because your better off has nothing to do with my better off. Are “we” better off as a whole? Better off in what respect? Well, yes, I do believe the answer to that can be brought to objective scrutiny once the conditions are defined. Are these conspiracy theories that are being taken so seriously by those who should know better based on fact, or are they fabrications? Objectively, a fact can most certainly be prooven a fact, and a fabrication prooven a fabrication. Do those fabricating fabricated consipracy theories know better, and are they doing it in order to manipulate the masses? I say yes, but maybe not. Maybe they really are just batshit crazy.

      • That’s a misleading question because the question is subjective. It’s not a “True/False” question its based on each individuals perspective. PERIOD!

      • Swooper

        Huh? Could you be any more ambiguous? “That’s” referring to what. I think this gets precisely to Jeanne Biles Crawford point. Let’s define things so we have clarity and can determine facts from fabrications.

        A great part of every liberal’s effort in debate and discourse with the right is that those on the right like to throw everything into a blender to create confusion about the subject at hand. They have no love of clarity, and in that way, they feel they have a better chance at winning debates. Rarely does it succeed because liberals just are too smart, logical and savvy to let that pass.

      • Did you even bother looking at who I was replying to?

      • Shirley Williams

        Well, the job numbers have improved as much as they could with no cooperation from Congress on the President’s jobs bills. And the stockmarket has nearly doubled under Obama. Every bit of progress we have made has been squeezed out of Rs by force and most have just said “NO” the whole timel. There entire agenda was to make this President a one term President. Since that failed, they have just pushed their ridiculous policies while they have the black man to blame. I am a Liberal and the worst thing Obama has done is give into the right on everything.

      • onewhoknows

        Now the real question is .. what has congress done in the past 4 years to improve our nation as a whole.. the answer is NOTHING.. and why not? Many things could have been done to recover faster but that didn’t happen.. Who benefited from this slowdown? The people or corporations? We are now at the heart of the issue. Corporations are controlling our govt, not us.

      • You won’t get much disagreement on that one from me. Vote out the shills who work for the corporations and vote in people like Bernie Sanders & Al Franken!

      • Phenoy

        The blender analogy is a good example..and whatever material that blender comes up with, they blindly put their hands in it, pull out a piece and say “Look! this one looks like Benghazi, this one is the IRS, this one looks like a gay dude with horns….”

      • Betty Caron

        This really made me laugh because it’s so true.

      • suburbancuurmudgeon

        Yes, we are better off than we were four years ago.

      • frumpus

        We definitely are much better off today than we were 4 years ago. 2008 was a horrible year when the recession was at its peak. We have recovered majorly since then.

      • Brian Darling

        are you kidding me wake up were fucked

      • Diana Bauer

        john1966 – perfect example of “conservative republican.”

      • Brent Slensker

        Where did you “read” that?!?

      • Typical response from an indoctrinated slave. Is your tin foil hat properly secured, slave?

      • John1966

        Soothe yourself with insults all you want. It proves you have nothing substantive to say.

      • Hogshooter

        Seriously dude, look at your posts and tell us where you proved or even claimed anything substantive? Really…look back and you’ll see the most meaningful thing you’ve offered here is your first, followed by a series of “I know you are but what am I” statements. Just take 3 minutes to TRY to understand…it’s either do that, or prove the article absolutely right. The evidence is just a few lines up. I’m thinking you’ll just plug your ears and keep trucking right along, though.Fantasy land must be really nice.

      • John1966

        Soothe yourself by escalating your insults. It only proves you have nothing substantive to say.

      • Randell Cinnamon

        John, troll all you like. However, it will not change the fact that you are wrong and that you have nothing objective to say at all whatsoever. You are a typical indoctrinated slave that needs the GOP to think and do for you. So, if all you seek to do is regurgitate what is shoved down your throat by Fux news, Beck, Limbaugh and Jones, then you have succeeded. You failed because you can’t cite any form of truth and that you have failed in every debate you have participated in. Enjoy your dying party, because next year they will be obsolete.

      • redhand126

        The market has doubled since Obama’s inauguration. Fact Up!

      • Jim Tabor

        I know that’s what you want to believe, but it just isn’t true. It isn’t fact-based. No matter how many times you say it, it still won’t be true.

      • Jim Tabor

        I know that’s what you want to believe, but it just isn’t true. It isn’t fact-based. No matter how many times you say it, it still won’t be true.

      • Perfect example of projection, and how much you righties suck at it.

      • yeah, they always have these one line replies that have no meaning. Republicans never truely debate anything. think they’re mostly stupid.

      • Brian Darling

        go fuck your self

      • John1966

        Ouch, I’ve been insulted by someone who lashes against anything too rational for them to understand.

      • The Shinner

        John, having read your comments on here, you’ve written nothing but childish insults. I don’t suppose you have anything more substantial?

      • Jim F

        You people sit there and call conservatives stupid and and everything else you can think of.What you don’t understand is by stooping to that level you show yourself to be no better than the people you are degrading. That being said, as far as the general public is concerned, politics is nothing more subjective ideas handed down by the different parties that are trying to get all us to believe that their ideas are better than everyone else’s. Although I conservative, that does not mean that I think all liberal ideas are bad. In fact, I think what they should do si take the best ideas of all parties involved and then all sit down and come up with a plan. The way it is now, parties just seem to take any asinine idea that they can come up with and and then have big pissing contests to see who can come out on top. We as a people need to stop hanging on blindly to our parties and open up our eyes. We are the ones that control who goes to Washington D.C. and who doesn’t.

      • The Shinner

        Was that aimed at me? Because I don’t recall mentioning conservatives.

      • Swooper

        Just go away. You have nothing and you know it.

      • Dale Mulkey

        go back to bed john. your not intelligent enough to be allowed on line without an adult present

      • Timaloha

        We can debate that when you post something rational. Hasn’t happened yet, and I’m not optimistic that it ever will.

      • Judith_Priest

        Does it bother you to be this partisan AND this stupid, John? It ought to.

        Your response was about equivalent to, “I’m rubber, you’re glue, what you say bounces offa me and back on YOU-UUU!”

        Except it doesn’t. There is NO WAY that what Jeanne Biles Crawford said “works” on Liberals.

        We question; YOU suck up drivel fed to you by the people who only want your Really Stupid Misinformed Librul-Hatin’ Kneejerk Vote so they can keep running the country into the ground, or selling it to their 1% buddies, whom you reverence, I know. I’m surprised you don’t PRAY to your rich overlords, as you hate the Liberals, who are really about all that stands between you and economic slavery for the rest of your life.

        You ass.

      • John1966

        I’ve read your one-page playbook; you don’t have to read it to me. It’s full of nothing but insults because you have no concern for reason.

      • Hogshooter

        Gonna call troll on John here. Look at what you wrote and dispute the fact that it’s the epitome of partisan and stupid. Blanket generalization of a perceived group of people based on nothing but your own opinion…that’s stupid…and I’d bet you don’t even know exactly why you think that other than having heard Rush or Hannity or Bill say it once or twice. What “reason” did you offer at all in either of those posts except to make your claim, get shot down on it and then play victim because your argument couldn’t hold water…hell it couldn’t hold a bag of skittles. It’s also hard to ignore how you’re conveniently absent after your stupidity is pointed out. Way to back outa the room there, chief. You really should take a long look in a mirror and think about how you’ve allowed yourself to be manipulated to argue against your own best interests…unless of course you’re a billionaire, in which case it makes sense, I guess. But even the billionaire is killing him/herself by claiming trickle-down economics is anything other than the opposite of what makes economies grow. It’s really quite elementary…certainly, at most, middle school social studies now that I think about, actually.

      • John1966

        I took your advice and reevaluated myself. I’ve confirmed that I’m rational, while you are a slave to your contempt.

      • Dale Mulkey

        no john mostly your just an idiot with out brains enough to understand truth or facts

      • John1966

        Thanks for confirming that you liberals fill the gaps in your logic by reaching into your souls and pulling out gratuitous contempt.

      • 65snake

        Oops, you misspelled “completely deserved”.

      • Haskell Nixon

        And now we hear from one of the brain dead. john you are nuts.

      • John the difference between a liberal and a “conservative” is that a liberal always questions even their own beliefs while a “conservative” will hang on to their belief regardless of the evidence that contradicts it.

      • John1966

        Go ahead and soothe yourself with imaginary beliefs.

      • Flo_C

        Ha! Got a bit of a “God” complex going there, John? Bet you post these same things indiscriminately on all the political sites. Bet you have no beliefs at all – except in your supreme mental acuity.

      • Randell Cinnamon

        Actually, John1966 has an inferiority complex. Its obvious within his posts and even more obvious within his mental state. Perhaps his tinfoil hat is on too tight.

      • Var Enyo

        I’ve seen him so much trolling, in fact, he must be either paid to do it or a lazy guy with no job.

      • frumpus

        Go fuck yourself, asshole

      • Charlie Patin

        Please identify who you’re writing to, Frumpus. We have no idea who’s your target.

      • 65snake

        It shows quite clearly who he is replying to.

      • lindylou

        John, the republicans have sold much of this country on an illusion that we can “recapture” the good old days, when, in reality, there never were any good old days. The family of four (or fifteen) in a nice house with a picket fence and mom doing housework in high heels and pearls was an illusion, and behind the scenes, it wasn’t very nice.

      • jim55price

        No, John1966, liberalism is better defined as caring more about how thinking is performed than about what specifically is thought. A conservative teacher will say, “Learn these 12 things, be able to spit them out verbatim on command, & you will be considered educated.” A liberal teacher will say, “The facts you can instantly spit out are less important than your ability to synthesize what you’ve memorized with observations of the real world around you.” There’s merit to both approaches — I’m all for conservatively memorizing Newton’s three laws of physics verbatim, for instance, but I’d be liberally loathe to call anyone who can spit them out a physicist. So, you need to get a better handle on your concept of “description”. Looks like a dictionary would be a good start.

      • Taylor Walston

        From my experience, both sides are equally susceptible to running with a sound byte that affirms what they want to believe. Most of my liberal friends post on Facebook not to start conversation, or have meaningful debate to evolve their position, but to have a bunch of like minded friends click like. And I have had conversations with conservatives who’s dialog stopped at the end of the sound byte as well. Nobody has a monopoly on the truth and all the mud slinging at the other side while complimenting yourselves is yet another distraction. Right where the politicians want you….

      • Swooper

        Wow, that comment is a candidate for an award as Most Substantive. Lot of intense research and editing surely went into the effort of explaining how your statement is so.

      • Dale Mulkey

        perfect example of an idiot

      • gemma liar

        HEY JOHN,,,,,,,,,, hows that rightwing regressive amercian policies thing doing for ya??? michelle malkin (UGGH,,no tits),,,sean nfatboy Hannity and littledick beck making MILLIONS laughing at all the cretins such as you who ascribe to all their mis information. lets get back to the glory of Reagan with IRAN contra and outsourcing our jobs and debt; plus QUADRUPLING our deficit,,,or maybe gw bush and those silly little WMDs which stared a lie based war which NOT only killed over 4400 American soldires ( 4 dead in Benghazi) but allowd IRAN to again be a total pest in our-and israels – side by killing the despot who they were totally kept in check in mortal fear by! (SEE: saddam H),,,,great policies guys!!!

    • Absolutely. I don’t know how many times I’ve seen Boehner, McConnell et. al twisting words or conveniently leaving things out when they make their statements in front of the cameras. I know what just happened. I’ve heard what was just said but when you listen to those “leaders” you will get a perversion of the facts. Yes, indeed, they know exactly what they are doing, and the masses (read ignorant, racist, bigoted, whatever) hang on their every word and there is no arguing, because that is what they want to believe.

      • ilgoldst

        Does anyone actually believe that Speaker Boehner believes what he is saying? Poor schm*ck gets the job of his dreams and finds out he is leading a group of rabid dogs. If he says or does the wrong thing they will tear him to shreds. So he spends the next four, five, six years with absolutely no influence saying dumb things he doesn’t believe to keep a job that turned out to be awful. The best thing that could possibly happen to him is for the Democrats to somehow retake the House. Sen. McConnell on the other hand might be as dim witted as he looks. I hope so, because otherwise it is amazing that he was ever elected.

        Just to show you a liberal can be even handed, I don’t think a hell of a lot of Sen. Reid.

    • Right, but go farther… They need these minions as foot soldiers in the coming fascist military coup.

  • John1966

    Congratulations, you lowered your blood pressure by mocking those you hate.

    • Dee_Lemon

      They just make it so easy. Who could resist?

  • Johnny Brown

    I liked the article, I couldn’t have said it better!

  • Good point Alexis, I have been say that “they” are NOT conservative by any stretch of the imagination since Reagan the destroyer. Unless of course the description is a fuzzy for them as the truth and facts.

  • James Daley

    Members of GOP and the conservative movement are desperate hacks. When you have no substance within your policies and only govern with a ridiculous and extreme ideology your appeal becomes limited. In the end, GOP voters get what they deserve from their candidates and elected officials because they themselves have low expectations and standards.
    You can’t help stupid.

  • Frank Gallagher

    please please republicans and especially the tea party keep up the good work lol. like chris matthews said today. at the rate they are going we are going to have 16 more years of a democrat president.

    • Baaly

      I’d love for that to be true. Unfortunately, people have very short memories when it comes to politics.

  • Ninya

    Except, Obama never lived in the Philippines. Then again they never bother with facts.

  • katherine norton malek

    It ammazed me during the last election ppl were more concerned (rather belatedly) with Pres. Obama’s birth certificate than they were with Romney’s evasion of tax returns & the knowledge that a presidential candidate didn’t even use US banks & yet he claimed to be “patriotic”. No one cared that the Romney horse has better health care than many Americans .. human Americans. Just showed me they care nothing for who sat in the oval office, as long as it was a Republican & not Obama. Now, the big hoo-hah over Benghazi bombing when under Bush/Cheney, numerous embassies were bombed. Calling for Pres. Obama to be impeached – when he’s actually done a fair hob of cleaning up the Bush/Cheney mess he walked into. I say “fair job” because if he had an ounce of bi-partisan support, he could undoubtedly get even more accomplished.

  • DemSign

    Actually in a Democratic primary race there are 57 “states” (the 50 states, plus DC, the territories of VI, PR, AS, MP, and GU, and Democrats Abroad hold primaries, caucuses, and/or conventions). In the GOP there are only 56 as they don’t give their ex-pats a primary. Obama wasn’t misspeaking, nor did he mean to say he “visited 47 of 50 states.”

    • David Young

      Sorry but neither territories nor “Democrats Abroad” are

      Obama misspoke. Get over it.

  • I prefer to call them anti-American treasonost traders. Certainly not patriots or even Con-derivatives.

  • One of the main planks in the political platform is: “The more you keep away or take away from the poor, the homeless, the disabled, the handicapped and the huddled masses yearning to breathe free, the more you get to keep for yourself.

  • MelHaun Sr

    The last conservative President was probably IKE, and any semblance of conservatism disappeared with Reagan.

    • He was also the last Republican elected without cheating or committing some form of pre-election treason.

      Odd how that all meshes together.

  • RU_Kidding

    2 points: #1 Recent poll- if the 2014 vote were today, would you vote DEM or GOP? 40% STILL said GOP! UNBELIEVABLE! (We are truly a stupid nation run by dolts!) #2 Alexis Muller has a point. Nomenclature can be important. I would suggest calling them what they are: “American Taliban”, rather than “conservative”, or “reactionaries” or even “obstructionists”…

  • Tiptoesan

    It seems that the Republican party works on the “I’m the loudest, so I’m right” mentality of winning a discussion. There comes an age in every persons life when this tactic ceases to be an acceptable form of debate…and that age is six. With so much in-fighting in the Republican party between the Old Guard and the Tea Baggers, it’s amazing to think that they honestly think that they can fix the country. Hell, they can’t even fix themselves. The people spoke in the last election and they’ll continue to speak at the voting booths. As long as the Republicans keep up their display of hatred and childish antics, the Dems will continue to keep winning.

  • Watching Karl Rove on election night…priceless.

  • mike

    So u proved you’re mentally retarded big deal. U distort facts and flat out dont know anything. The dumbest person alive believes he knows everything. (So basic every liber nut job) if u want to better the country start by ending ur worthless life

    • Gary Smith

      Point out the distortions and prove it with actual verifiable fact. Go ahead … I dare you.

  • Miguel

    I like to remind Conservatives that one of their own really did see Romney’s tax returns — when Romney was on McCain’s VP short list, McCain asked for and received seven years worth of Romney’s returns. Then, after reviewing those returns, McCain went with Sarah Palin for VP. ‘Nuff said.

  • Actually, Allen, your dissertation would be much longer than 5 pages and would be nominated by your professors for the doctoral student dissertation of the year award at any Ivy League institution.

  • Bruce Winther

    Carl Rove is one of the most dangerous men this country has ever seen and he and the other hierarchy Republicans in Congress would not know the truth if it bit them in the ass!!! They will never learn honesty, compassion, empathy or generosity—all foreign to them and shame on them all for doing what they have done the past 5 years–disgraceful!!!

  • Hogshooter

    “I always liked asking them whether or not they felt GOP politicians were happy when positive economic numbers came out. ”

    True to the form you illustrated here, I spent a lot of time wondering just how the hell they would deal with it when, before November, unemployment slipped below 8% after they spent the whole campaign fudging the facts so they could claim BO broke a promise he never actually made. I even asked a few of my “conservative” “friends” directly and there was just no plan B, which I think is the real problem with them. I knew it would happen based on the reality of the then rapidly declining unemployment rate. What do they do? Claim the method of measurement…the same one they would have used had it been right at 8%; the same one they used to complain about unemployment as long as it was over 8%…is flawed. Unskewed polls is another prime example of them creating their own reality, much to their own detriment, if you ask me.. They seem literally incapable of thinking beyond the latest “here’s how we’ll get him!” There’s usually something blatantly obvious to discredit it right away and then, where a normal person just MIGHT think “wow I was wrong,” these cats never do. They double down, straight up lie or just ignore the obvious and seem to live by the idea that if you say something that’s totally wrong or downright false confidently, loudly and repeatedly enough, a few people will buy into to an extent that it renders obvious reality, facts and reason useless, or at least questionable somehow, which is really what they do best; making other dumbies like themselves doubt utterly provable, common-sense information, also known as the real world.

  • Memeremalek

    Great article as always. When Fox News & other Republican media continued to paint a rosey political picture of Romney’s assured win by claiming legitimate polls were skewed they unwittingly did us all a huge favor. Republicans were so confident the election was won they saw no reason to get out to vote. Afterall, their one vote wasn’t that necessary was it? While Dems pounded the pavement to get voters registered & to the polls, many fearing the GOPers were right. Yuck-yuck. Not a genius strategy.
    Why the issue of Romney the bully didn’t universally disgust ppl is sheer amazement to me. When I heard ppl dismiss it as a HS prank my blood boiled. I raised 4 teens to adulthood. In their worst behavior moments not one of them would have dreamed wrestling down a classmate & chopping off his hair. That’s beyond bullying, it’s sociopathic behavior. Regardless of how long ago it was – it speaks volumes to the content of his character. And character is something within us all.
    As they continue to alienate womens, blacks, hispanics and the LGBT community, I believe we will not see a Rep. Pres. for many yrs. and they’ll lose ground in the House & Senate following this distastrious run.

  • Rachael, Face it, these people are following the fascist playbook. Reasoned debate may inform onlookers, but you’ll never change the minds of these troo believers!

  • Ross Nesbitt

    I wonder what Mr. Conservative had to say on this topic…

    I’m frankly sick and tired of the political preachers across this
    country telling me as a citizen that if I want to be a moral person, I
    must believe in “A,” “B,” “C” and “D.” Just who do they think they are?
    And from where do they presume to claim the right to dictate their moral
    beliefs to me?

    And I am even more angry as a legislator who must endure the threats of
    every religious group who thinks it has some God-granted right to
    control my vote on every roll call in the Senate. I am warning them
    today: I will fight them every step of the way if they try to dictate
    their moral convictions to all Americans in the name of “conservatism.”

    Speech in the US Senate (16 September 1981)

  • Mike Smollon

    Before the last election here in Florida, Go.v Rick Scott was campaigning on the improved economy and jobs increases. He was told by the Republican Party to tone it down, because that helped Obama.

  • TedVothJr

    ‘Calling Reagan a “conservative legend” doesn’t make any sense…’ Sure does, according to this definition:



    a nonhistorical or unverifiable story handed down by tradition from earlier times and popularly accepted as historical.

  • Aaron Levesque

    Couldn’t agree more. One thing, as an English teacher who’s seen this increasingly in the news media, I must say: journalists should be aware that it’s not “try and” but “try to.”

    • I Once Was Andrew

      A colloquialism that’s entered common speech, for better or worse; we’re stuck with it now.

  • Marti Salvato

    Look no further than the RNC for the epitomy of spin with their “WE BUILT THAT” mantra in a publicly funded convention center

    The weirdest soundbite? (well, other than Clint batting for the other side with his empty chair monologue)

    Ann Romney: “I LOVE YOU WOMEN!” Uh, Ann, thanks but no thanks. “We’ve told YOU people everything you need to know.” yowza.

  • Get your story straight

    Obama lived in Indonesia, not the Philippines when he was nine years old.

  • Shore Bud Mike

    Plain and simple: Presenting a Republican with facts has the same effect as exposing a vampire to the light of day.

  • Sue Heinlein

    I don’t bother trying to give them facts. They just start saying their talking points they heard on Fox News louder, as if shouting makes their opinions right! I just say quietly, I guess you know it all and they shut up. Maybe it’s my astonished look when they are screaming? They know it all… You can’t fix stupid….

  • bpless

    Someone should question Mitt Romney’s birth place because his father George Romney was born in Mexico because HIS father moved there when the U.S, outlawed having more than one wife at a time.

    • republicans are traitors

      boom. there it is. another favorite fact, ted nugent shit his pants repeatedly to get out of going to the Vietnam war. there a patriot for ya!

  • xnerd

    the saddest thing is that I was just looking at foxnews the other day and they are attributing the recovery to Bush,.,…..

    And their brain dead users in the comment section were all agreeing with that

  • CaughtInTheMiddle

    The problem is that our system was not intended for professional politicians. After a certain point, they all lose contact with the people, no matter what side. They become wrapped up in keeping their job and not really doing what is best for the country and all the people. It takes millions of dollars to get elected. Only the rich get elected. We the People have no representation in D.C. anymore. Both sides fight and we lose!

  • JED

    How do I get off this bullshit site? Nothing but loonies trying to preach the backwards notions of demoRATS, solicilasts and communists. NOTHING AMERICAN about these clowns! A demoRAT wouldn’t know a FACT if they were hit in the ass with it (“OH, is Bill Clinton back in town). FOOLS! ALL OF THEM!! UNPATRIOTIC (to the United States) to be sure. GO AWAY; YOU IDIOTS!! IF JFK were alive to day not only would he be ASHAMED of what the DIMoRAT party has become, he would be MORE TO THE RIGHT than today’s REPUBLICANS. For ANYBODY to follow Barry Hussein is a total mystery – the jerk needs a Teleprompter to talk to KINDERGARDEN children… the SAME wy address ALL of his supporters (which in and of itself is a TELL). Low grade in any book. And when the Teleprompter fails… he’s a babbling idiot. MEGA FAIL is what Barry Hussein is… FAIL! And all his minions — ass-kissing FAILURES at life, liberty, but not those free rides he promises.

    • SophieCT

      See that X in the upper right hand corner. Click it. If a dialog box comes up, click Yes.

    • republicans should die

      you cant navigate a website, but yet you claim to know so much about everything else….republicans are the true enemies of the state and traitors. they sell out the american people daily so they can line their pockets and get giant paycheck from k-street when their professional scumbag political job is over.Sir, jed (shoulda known you would have a redneck name like fucking jed), please die horribly and save us the trouble of having to eventually hang your republican traitor ass from a tree in the white house lawn.

  • melloe

    Interesting article with a lot of good points, But other than possible feel good moment, there is little to be gained by discussions with the average hard core extremest from the right or Left. The difference of course, the ones on the left are usually not as dangerous to the country and the poor and middle class. Those on the right are usually spouting ideas dangerous for the country, and anyone other than the corporate, very rich, and sadly, usually dangerous to / for themselves. Any ideas, facts, scientific findings, opinions, or writings not from a few selected radio hosts, WND sites, The multitude of “think tanks’, or fox propaganda machine are discounted without consideration.

    OTOH, any “facts” presented by those on the right are usually in the form of some opinion piece, a carped statement by some politician, a mangled comment about some statement a Democratic politician taken out of context, or one of the many “scientific” parodies produced by one of several right wing think tanks ( what an oxymoron ), or just lies…. from one of many propaganda outlets. Fox being one of the most popular with them.

    I mean, how can one “discuss” anything with someone whose opening gambit includes something about Obama ( which they will seldom use. It is usually some bastardization of his name ) being a Socialists, Marxist, commie ( nasty word ) born in Kenya and you are a libtard. I usually say, “better than a Retard” if really frustrated with them… which does not help any.

  • 2fromrightbutstillsowrong

    It wouldn’t make much difference, those I know who dislike Obama dislike him because they don’t know shit about politics, and only repeat what they hear those that watch FOX news tell them. They comment on post like this without reading it, as is usually obvious by what they say in those comments. But the saddest is the otherwise smart, intelligent, and by all other measure good people that say the stupidest most ignorant things regarding anything attached to Obama because they buy into things said by those calling themselves Christians, and have some fear of being outcasts by family or peers for NOT disliking Obama. It’s fucking nuts. They don’t understand how the deficit and debt are not related, they don’t get that Social Security has nothing to do with the deficit, they don’t understand the word Entitlement, they think legislation and confiscation are the same thing, and worst of all, they truly believe Obama is not American and that he is a Muslim trying to destroy the country. Why? God only knows. But its truly amazing that you can show them in black and white the facts that dispute their beliefs, and they will look you in the eye and with a straight face tell you the still believe the lies. It’s very very sad.

  • SophieCT

    I agree the right sucks. You still don’t have to overdo being an Obama apologist. For example, “and you’d probably hear about the time in 2008 when Obama once accidentally said there were 57 states, when he obviously meant to say he had visited 47 of the 50 states during his campaign.”
    It’s possible he was referring to the 57 primary/caucus races which include more than just 50 states (like Guam, Puerto Rico, etc.) But we won’t know what he meant when people fill in the blanks for him as if he couldn’t do that himself.

  • Johnny Rinaldo

    Can we take a moment here and examine what “journalism” has become?
    Not all republicans are in the same camp any more than democrats or libertarians. I’m registered green party, but I also support gun laws. Can we maybe stop with the rash generalizations and senseless bitching and actually just present people with facts and let them make up their own minds. Isn’t that what being “liberal” is all about?

  • Lynn Tschimperle Beamon

    Republicans get more vile and ridiculous everyday..

  • mike o rama

    If democrats win the whitehouse again in 16 and gain ground in congress, I predict republicans will push to overturn their “citizens united” failure, being beat once again at there own game.

  • gemma liar

    I; as a liberal independent ( financially conservative; liberal socially) think U clowns should give the regressive tea bag party republicans,,,and all republicans– much more true credit!!! Cmon!!! These great americans are simply doing whatever it takes to keep getting RE elected by the low IQ inbred white trash pseudo intellectual CHRISTIAN trash who keep preaching the same old rhetoric from the FOX “news” / Koch bothers/ ‘freedom works’ playbook! The best part is our dear friends who crycrycry about all the non issues ( or issues which repubs have either initiated or did heavily in past policies) is that they are acutely aware that NO ONE will hold them legally or financially accountable for LIES and misinformation ( SEE: half truths)….this strategy is akin to a traffic cop pulling you over for BIG speeding violation and sternly admonishing you for doing 75 in a school zone,,,,yet having NO BITE to ticket you– his rage will subside,,,,he will go back to his job and YOU ( and the rightwing trash) will snickeringly continue to SPEED heavily ( lie brazenly) knowing U are immune from any true prosecution. I will admit that if FOX “news” asked me to have my own prime time TV or radio show and my sole format was to blister the liberals and especially OBAMA,,,and they offered a starting yearly paycheck of 500K per year ( with 5 yr contract minimum and incentives based upon ratings) I would throw down my liberal antics ( publicly) and join the hate the left commie anti Christ brigade IMMEDIATELY!!!! HALLALUYAH!! PRAISE JESUS AND RONALD REAGAN!!! I ALSO AM NOW A ”GREAT AMERCIAN”!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • gemma liar

    exCUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUSE meeeeeeeeeeeeee!! why do we ( and me also) argue with these regressive crybabies on the right? they are immune from facts….obfuscate expostulatory conversations: U will have a better chance of getting my pet TEGU to speak English than a rightwing WHITE TRASH regressive to adhere to what his/her church and peers demand he/she “thinks”……get real liberals,,,,,,just realize we are winning and they are strophying and its beeee-uuuutiful to watch babies piss and poop and cry, dotcha think???

  • ExRadioGuy15

    Yes, we should stop calling them “Conservatives”…let’s call them what they really are: “Cons” (unconvicted criminals) or FASCISTS (they adhere to all 14 defining charactetistics of Fascism) or BOTH….ssmdh

  • Karla Shreckengaust

    Reactionary is a good word. I keep remembering things that other people seem to remember differently, and then look up, and my memory is fine. And comparisons are odious, since we keep seeing Republicans trying to compare apples and oranges.

  • Rita Jane Clark-Smith

    Karl Rove gave America the Bush/Chaney presidency. Why in the world does anyone pay any attention to this fool from Texas??

  • Farmergirl

    Craziest thing a Tea Partier has said to me so far: “I wouldn’t call it ‘The Bill of Rights’. It was more like a ‘Bill of Suggestions’.

  • Guile Williams

    You know, during all my time online, debating with all the republicans, I have noticed one simple truth that the republicans have over democrats. They are LOUDER.