The Real Reason Republicans Hate Welfare And Food Stamps

food stamps ebtThese days, it seems that the majority of conservatives tend to view the world through a very simplistic scope that allows little room for discussion, interpretation, or compromise. We have reached a point where any questioning of unregulated capitalism automatically gets you labeled as a socialist, communist, Marxist, or Fascist because those are all interchangeable right?



When President Obama became the Democratic nominee in 2008, conservatives unleashed a vicious tornado of attacks labeling him a Kenyan born dictator who supported redistribution of wealth, taking from those who have, and giving it to those who do not. They were right about part of that. He does believe in redistribution of wealth but guess what? So do most Americans.

If your children go to a public school, if your streets are patrolled by the city or county law enforcement, if your garbage is picked up by city workers, if you have ever dialed 911, if you or anyone in your family has worked in the public sector, if you’ve ever claimed deductions on your taxes, and if you’ve ever driven on a public road, not only have you condoned redistribution, you have supported it.

The modern day conservatives are led to believe that all government is bad, and that they don’t need government in their everyday lives. We have reached a point of insanity where an average Joe making 30,000 a year drives on a public road, to drop his kids off at a public school, all while listening to conservative talk radio tell him how evil every aspect of government is. This disconnect from reality is unreal.

The truth is, many of the services that Americans rely on are rooted in redistribution. Social Security, Medicaid, public safety services, and emergency services are just a few of the redistributive services that all Americans enjoy, while never even realizing that they are a form of democratic socialism.

Why then do conservative Americans freak out when a family needs food stamps to eat, or when a young mother needs WIC, or TANF to survive? The answer is racism.

I’ve had friends over the years that took advantage of public assistance services for their families such as WIC or Food stamps. The truth of the matter was, they really didn’t need them, but in their minds, they earned the right to use these public services since they worked and paid taxes. The problem was, they were all white, and they all shared a disdain for minorities that receive public assistance. You see, when white people use public assistance, they are getting back what they’ve paid in – but when black people or other minorities use public assistance, they are lazy and entitled. Sadly, that’s how many conservatives think.

The Republican Party has done a wonderful job of getting everyday, white  Americans to look down upon, and demonize minorities for doing the same thing that they do, all while being oblivious to the fact that they are being robbed blind by the billionaires behind the Republican party money machine. In the South, there is an understood but subtle racism among many white people that is rarely talked about, but always present. Just delve into any comment section of a local news story on virtually any city in a southern state that involves the subject of an African American, and those dog whistles turn into sirens very quickly.

You see, it all goes back to looking at a very complex world through a very simplistic lens. It doesn’t work. Modern day conservatives truly believe that everyone is given the same exact opportunity to succeed regardless of their race or where they come from, and that is just not true. Study upon study proves that African Americans and minorities have a much harder path to success than their white counterparts, yet when they look to take advantage of the same public assistance services that many white people enjoy, they are demonized, they are called lazy freeloaders, they are made into the punch lines of jokes, and they are ridiculed beyond belief – all because of an obvious double standard that is rooted in white privilege.


Ben Madison

Ben Madison is a Liberal political activist who believes in an America where everyone is afforded the opportunities to achieve their goals and dreams regardless of color, race, gender, or socioeconomic status. He has spent time in Texas as well as North Carolina and currently resides in Louisiana. He is the founder of The Middle Class is Drowning on Facebook and can be followed on Twitter @BenHMadison.

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  • FD Brian

    I’m sure the country is full of the people described above that hate welfare, but I also know people who don’t think it’s the governments job to take care of people and to provide for basic necessities and they would like to see religion take over that aspect of the welfare state. But what those people don’t understand that religion is not capable of handling that situation on the scale that the government does it.

    • Keith

      And who wants to hear about Bronze Age myths just so you can get enough for breakfast?

      • chris968

        Well occasionally I am in the mood for a good fairy tale… lol.

    • Victoria Gutshall

      Absolutely! I volunteer at a food pantry, and the economic situation in this country has caused a sharp rise in the need for our services, while at the same time donations are drying up. Often the people we see coming for food are the same people who once donated to us! There are days where we have practically nothing to give other than a few bits of fruit and vegetables that are on the verge of spoiling. Try as we might, we just cannot fulfill the need. NO private organization can, the need is just far too great.

      • FD Brian

        and when was the last time the pantry received a substantial donation from a rich person?

  • bestfriend

    So, what you’re saying here, and correct me if I’m wrong, is, Republicans are pure evil!

    • Brenda Mapp

      You better check again you will find out who the evils are and its not the republicans

      • bestfriend

        I’ll go back and look. I may have been mistaken, it was kind of dark and I’d had a few drinks.

      • chris968

        LOL you must be a Repuglican. When was the last time one of them tried to help someone but themselves or a corporation? Never, that’s right.

      • strayaway

        Under Obama, the average US family’s income has declined while the 1% have accelerated their ownership of national wealth at a faster rate than under Bush. Under Obama, black income, wealth, and home ownership have declined relative to those of whites. Under Obama, racial relations have, according to a recent poll, declined to their lowest levels since 1992.

        Corporations get everything they want under Obama.Trade pacts send US jobs abroad. Record numbers of legal and illegal aliens are allowed to undercut the wages of US workers’ jobs still here. What’s Obama up to this week? He is trying to fast track the TPP and other trade legislation that even Congress members cannot have copies of or take notes on. I’m not saying Republicans are better about the TPP or promoting cheap labor options but our working class and middle class Americans have been taking it on the chin under Obama. Corporations aren’t going to care whether Hillary of Jeb get elected either.

      • miketothad

        False equivalence horseshit.

      • strayaway

        Mike, Well done. That was one of your most vacuous information free posts.

      • miketothad

        lol… learn the word.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        You don’t have to address logical fallacies, you point them out then dismiss the line of argumentation. Putting forward fallacious arguments is vacuous, which makes your comment a perfect example of projection.

      • Brenda Mapp

        What has the demos done for you? right nothing because if they had you wouldn’t be still complaining

      • chris968

        At least the Democrats aren’t consistently trying to cut food stamps and welfare for the need. (Ahem, Republicans).

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
        So opposing civil rights, hoarding wealth, marginalizing the poor and needy, profiting from war and destroying the environment aren’t evil, got it.

      • Bill Filey

        Check what?

      • Kenneth Henderson

        So you must be the white elephant then? You are that ONE Republican who actually helps the poor, fights against corporations, stands up for workers and their rights to live not on minimum wage but on a liveable wage, oh and you aren’t racist either I take it too. YEA RIGHT!

      • Brenda Mapp

        No you stupid idiot I face each day the same as others .I have to worry about how I can get by so don’t come at me like some roaring lion its hard for me too .but I don’t ask anyone to give me anything I didn’t work for I do have a little pride not like some folks who don’t they are completely happy to see others have to keep them up .

      • Kenneth Henderson

        Typical Right Wing response, resort to name calling, without backing up any factual evidence. Thank you for proving my point.

      • Brenda Mapp

        Thanks for proving me right too Your an Idiot and I would say that no matter , Republican democrate or what ever

      • Kenneth Henderson

        Brenda, I am a retired Nuclear Engineer with a PhD in Biochemical Engineering. Sorry, but I am far from an idiot. However, from what little I’ve gathered from you, I’d say its fair to assume that you would never be able to reach my level of education and/or intelligence, just like the majority of the Tea Party. (Which I see you are a proud card carrying member of!)

      • Brenda Mapp

        You stupid dimwit i don’t care what kind of degree you have you know there are a lot of people with degrees but are dumb as a rock when it comes to common sense You have no clue as what i am .so don’t think you are that smart .And as for as me being as smart as you you have no clue .

      • Kenneth Henderson

        For what compassion I have to help my fellow man. (Including the gentleman who is asking for donations because he needs surgery to save his eyesight, yet he hates Obama, and never signed up for the ACA.) I help him because its the decent, compassionate, thing to do. I was assuming you were a human being, able to show the same, obviously you are not. For that I pity you, and your pathetic ilk. You are what is truly wrong with this country, and you are a fool if you think otherwise.

        I am ending this conversation here, you can post all you want, but I won’t respond. You are worth my time, or my energy anymore. I would say have a good week, month, year, life, ect. but there is nothing “good” about you. So I’ll end with don’t forget how to breathe. Goodbye.

      • frettadafrog

        Apparently you’re one of those Right Wing
        “Christians” who vote republican, eyes glued to Fox News and spew
        disgust at those with less than you.
        What little the poor have is too much for you. Right?

      • Brenda Mapp

        Yes I am a Christain and yes I am republican ,and yes I do watch Fox news but that has nothing to do with them taking peoples social security away from those that have worked for it and giving to those who didn’t
        Let me ask you if someone came in and took what you had worked for ,what you had built up to live on when you got old how would you like those apples. No on said we couldn’t help the poor I said the darn deadbeats that don’t want to do anything but sit on their but That is and was who I was talking about
        and no I don’t have much either but I don’t expect others to keep me up while I sit on my butt. Are you just someone who don’t have much or are you a deadbeat?

      • frettadafrog

        You’re lumping everybody in one basket. You don’t even know any of these people and you’re criminalizing/demonizing them. You’re not a
        ‘christian’. If you were you’d follow Jesus’ teaching.
        The second is this: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’ There is no commandment greater than these.” Mark 12:31
        AND
        Whoever gives to the poor will not want, but he who hides his eyes will get many a curse. Proverbs 28:27
        AND
        Matthew 7:1-3King James Version (KJV)
        7 Judge not, that ye be not judged.
        Don’t be surprised that one day karma visits you and takes a good chunk out of you.
        I’ll leave you with one more.
        A man reaps what he sows. Don’t be misled–you cannot mock the justice of God.You will always harvest what you plant. Do not be deceived: God is not mocked, for whatever one sows, that will he also reap. Galatians 6:7
        In other words, what goes around comes around.
        BTW, I have a beautiful 2 bedroom house that I own and I have some very nice things here, all my own furnishings and decorated the way I like it. I do believe in helping people less fortunate, so I go room to room twice a year, and decide what I don’t want or need anymore. It gets bagged or boxed up and goes to a local charity we have here called Associated Charities. When I buy new things for my house, I do it again. And again. My husband asked me why I do it. I said “Why not?” I don’t need all this stuff. We don’t have the room to keep everything and let someone else enjoy it.
        It’s not like I’m taking it with me when I die, because we all go out of this world the same way we came in. I also volunteer at the local soup kitchen three times a week. At Christmas time, I go caroling with friends and we raise money for the soup kitchen.
        I know what it’s like not to have much. I’ve been there. On the street. Homeless. With nothing, except the clothes I was wearing.
        I’m retired, I get Social Security AND I get food stamps too. Oh wait, according to people like you, I’m not even supposed to get that.
        Maybe that’s why you don’t have much? That’s what you said. You’re not looking out for anybody except yourself. If you think that God isn’t watching you, I’ve got some nice swampland in Arizona for sale.

  • Brenda Mapp

    Excuse me but social security is not government support ,People have worked hard and paid that every since they have worked that is put in for them to have when they can’t work anymore .Now there is talk of giving social security to illegals and other people who have never put a dime into it . Thats what Obama wants to do .Why should they be allowed help when other people put it in there its not government money.If you worked and put it in ,you get it out .If you didn’t work and put it in why in hell do you think you deserve it Thats not redistribution they is getting back what you put in .

    • wendy

      That is not what Obama wants to do. Illegals cannot get SS benefits

      • Brenda Mapp

        I did n’t say they were I said he is wanting to give them social security. Social security is for aging welfare is for others

      • strayaway

        “Under President Obama’s new program to protect millions of illegal immigrants from deportation, many of those affected will be eligible to receive Social Security, Medicare and a wide array of other federal benefits, a White House official said Tuesday.” -Washington Post 11/25/15

      • wendy

        Only those who put into SS and Medicare by working and paying taxes will be eligible for these programs. Its not a reward for doing nothing

      • strayaway

        I am just the messenger. In your previous post you declared. ” Illegals cannot get SS benefits”. I just quoted a White House official to prove you were wrong. Have your argument with the Obama administration on that point.

      • wendy

        As I read the quote; they will be eligible for these benifits, but not unless they put into the system as the rest of us.

      • strayaway

        You previously wrote that “That ( talk of giving social security to illegals) is not what Obama wants to do. Illegals cannot get SS benefits.” The White House spokesman says otherwise. Illegal aliens though are already receiving health, educational, and other social benefits whether or not they have put anything into the system. All of this drains coffers of assets available needed to assist needy Americans.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        This is called quibbling, you know that wendy is accurate in refuting the point that Brenda was trying to make. That all illegals were eligible to receive SS benefits. Although it is true that immigrants who pay into SS will be eligible for benefits, this policy change is quite recent (within the last year) and its reasonable to assume that wendy was ignorant of this change. This is supported by her willingness to read the link you posted and then redefine her argument based on the new evidence. (A trait you have failed to display in the dozens of post I have read of yours thorough this thread)

        “All of this drains coffers of assets available needed to assist needy Americans.”

        Hot tip: Most immigrants are already Americans, and fellow humans, and as such are just as entitled to the rights of life and liberty as any U.S. citizen.

      • strayaway

        The White House spokesman said they would be eligible to receive those benefits. I’ll go with that. For purposes of clear thinking, the correct and succinct legal term is “illegal alien”. US residents come in two varieties; citizens and aliens which legally just means non-citizens. Aliens, in turn, are either legal or illegal. Only Congress is delegated with the power to create uniform naturalization laws. Obama cannot change the law which is how he put it. All legislation is assigned to Congress.

        I was not referring to legal immigrants who followed the law, waited in line, received visas, and are in the process of legally becoming citizens. They are immigrants on two counts. They desired to immigrate and met the uniform requirement of moving here. I was referring, instead, to illegal aliens. Mohammed Atta and most of his crew members were illegal aliens because they overstayed their visas. They were not “immigrants” because they did not come here to live, and they were not here legally. There is a difference. Sloppy language makes it harder to muddle through the problem. According to Orwell, the point of Newspeak is to make it harder for the masses to think That’s why I harp on definitions.

        Unlike you, I believe in borders. And, yes, if there is a fixed amount of assets set aside for a government program, the more people who are allowed to take from that fund, the less there will be per recipient. So unless you know of a fairy godmother to provide for everyone who can pay passage or smugglers to cross our border, the less is available per recipient. I am an unapologetic supporter of US workers and the middle class. Your rhetoric seems, on the other hand, to side with economic invaders and the 1% profiting from cheaper labor.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        “Unlike you, I believe in borders.”

        Most bigots do.

      • strayaway

        If you don’t believe in borders, than take the locks off your exterior doors and always leave the keys in your car.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        So artificial divisions created by nation states to divide humanity are the same as personal property rights?

        False comparison.

        I can believe that I have a brotherhood with my fellow humans, and still understand the need for some goods to be privately owned for a well functioning society.

      • strayaway

        Yes they are. One division is personal. One is corporate. Why should you be allowed to privately own anything if some members of your brotherhood of humans might need it more? Aren’t you being hypocritical? Are you suggesting that your kids should be allowed to have better medical care and educations than would be illegal aliens? That you can own a car and a nice condo but they aren’t allowed to share them? Remember that you are the no border guy, How do you intend to defend your stuff?

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        ” Are you suggesting that your kids should be allowed to have better medical care and educations than would be illegal aliens?”

        Nope you’re strawmaning my position, everyone should have equal access to health care and education.

        “That you can own a car and a nice condo but they aren’t allowed to share them?”

        How about we provide them with one of their own? There are tens of thousands of empty houses and unused vehicles.

        “How do you intend to defend your stuff?”

        I hope to create an environment where that is unnecessary.

        Your entire argument is fallacious.

      • strayaway

        You remind me of the Chinese border guards who opened the gates of the Great Wall to allow their human brothers from Mongolia to share their country. They didn’t believe in border either. At leas they proved the ineffectuality of walls when protected by traitors. The rest of your justification for why you want to be able to maintain your personal property is flakey. The Obama’s, by the way spend, $34K/year for each of their daughters private school educations. Is suppose you oppose that too. I respect the Obamas as being caring parents for doing so. You aren’t a parent are you?

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        “You remind me of”

        Who cares.

        “The rest of your justification”
        ” Is suppose you oppose”

        Both Strawmen

        ” You aren’t a parent are you?”

        Supposition and Irrelevant to the discussion, and like most suppositions incorrect, I have a lovely daughter. Do you like being wrong over and over again?

      • strayaway

        You aren’t a parent are you?

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        Can’t read? I already answered that question.

      • strayaway

        Congratulations. My conjecture on that point was wrong. Most parents struggle to make their kids’ lives a little better. i took your comment about not believing in borders as giving away the store and suggesting you had no stake in the future. If we had no borders, then everyone in the world who could accumulate something like $1,200 for a plane ticket who wanted a job or social benefits could come here. Our social resources would be quickly exhausted and wages would take a nose dive. Forget being green, roads, parking lots, agricultural pressures would have to push sprawl to a limit. Of course we could build up like Hong Kong to accommodate hundreds of millions of new arrivals but it would still be an ecological nightmare.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        Nice conjecture, come up with proof of your fantasy and somebody might start to take you seriously

      • strayaway

        If you want to talk about fantasies lets talk about the viability our your open border fantasy.

      • strayaway

        Will bank robbers be eligible to collect Social Security on their earnings too if they declare them? Sometimes it’s more work burrowing through a vault wall then whatever doing work illegal aliens take from Americans.

      • Sherri G

        Nov 25 of 2015 has happened yet!

      • strayaway

        Thank you for the correction. That should be Nov 25, 2014. That was right after the president changed immigration laws on Nov. 21, 2014.

    • SandyTodd

      “illegals” racism. There are plenty of white US citizens who work under the table and collect benefits whenever they need it. There are plenty of undocumented workers who pay social security and will never be able to collect it. If you weren’t prone to being a racist, you’d know that and accept it

      • Brenda Mapp

        I am not a racist and you don’t have a clue. I didn’t say welfare I said social security. Yes there are plenty out there that sit on their ass and don’t do a damn thing I don’t care what color they are. you people that think its ok for some to have to keep others up or just a bunch of free loaders .Yes you are right there are undocumented workers that are here working and the only reason is they are undocumented. but you can bet your sweet little ass they are getting back every thing they do pay in.some way or the other

      • Ophelia5338

        There are also plenty of white illegals. ..geez
        U ppl and ur race card
        U are hurting true victims of racism

    • susanmcnichol

      He’s gonna do that just like he took your guns away. Please, read the laws. Illegals are not going to get SS.

      • Brenda Mapp

        I didn’t say he was I said he is wanting to ,Either case sinareo don’t count your chickens if he gets his way he will take your guns and there is not a damn thing you can do unless you are willing to fight .If he imposes martial law you will find out just what he will do

      • Dave

        Lol. martial law…. You’re one of those nut-jobs, then. Shouldn’t you be at infowars?

      • sharoncullars

        oh jeez, i heards he done killed all the patriots in texas with his military folk. RUN!!!!

      • frettadafrog

        What’s a sinareo?

      • Sam Trevino

        I suspect Ms. Mapp intended to spell scenario.

      • frettadafrog

        I know. I was just being snarky. 🙂

      • frettadafrog

        I know. I was just being snarky. 🙂

  • annum004

    Fingerpointing is stupid.

    I don’t belong to either party.

    The issue is getting handouts from the government, and in doing so, creating havoc.

    I’d rather starve as a free, sovereign citizen with rights, than to live high on the hog with privileges.

    • Sean Jones

      I guarantee people on welfare are not “living high on the hog”.

      • annum004

        Yep, you mean the privileged.

      • Beth Conrad

        I was born in to poverty and let me tell you there was nothing privileged about growing up in my household. I had eight siblings and we went to bed hungry most nights.

      • annum004

        Sorry to hear that.

        Privileges are different than Rights.

        Privileges come from State ownership of the People.

        You really don’t want privileges per se.

      • Beth Conrad

        Nice word salad. I got lucky and managed to work and educate my way into the middle class despite a$$***** like you.

      • annum004

        Wow!

      • sharoncullars

        please tell me how a family living on 1200 a month or less is privileged.

      • annum004

        You’re owned by the State.

        -You’re Chattel.

        You have no Rights.

        -Only Privileges.

        -Martial Law to boot.

    • chris968

      I receive food stamps and disability. I can GUARANTEE you that I am not “living high on the hog”. I don’t even bring in $900 a month disability and food stamps combined.

      • annum004

        Proof that privileges from the State doesn’t work.

        Sorry about that.

      • chris968

        It’s better than nothing though.

      • annum004

        Think outside of the box for a moment.

        There are more choices available than that.

        Take the initiative, be accountable, no fingerpointing, don’t depend on the State for everything and stand on your own 2 feet.

        You’ll feel better.

      • chris968

        Can’t really do that when I’m disabled and unable to work.

      • annum004

        -But you have you and your mind. There is hope.

        You have natural talents bestowed upon you that we all need.

      • Brenda Mapp

        Get a job!

      • chris968

        How about you go F yourself? You don’t know my situation and how dare you tell me to get a job? Being disabled doesn’t necessarily mean physical.

      • R. Eilers

        I’ll have to agree, even the disabled can have jobs. If you are online bragging about getting disability and food stamps you can be online making money with a job

      • chris968

        Wow why am I not surprised people judging me without even knowing me. I’m not bragging about getting disability and food stamps, I’m just contributing to the conversation. If I could work, I would. But you don’t know my situation and you never will, so I suggest you stop talking now.

      • Sam Trevino

        The issue is that people want simplification of complex issues, which means some people are simplistic and unsympathetic in their perspectives. To their limited perspective all they see is someone who is collecting government benefits (SNAP, SSI, or SSDI), but apparently does nothing to “earn” those benefits; thus labeling them a deadbeat, lazy, or other unsavory idiom.

        People who hold these perspectives compare themselves against their image of this often flawed perception of people who are participating in theses benefits and think “Why can’t these people just go get a job.” Such a comparison only goes to demonstrate a lack of education regarding those suffering from a disability. Of the people I know on disability, all, not some, all of them want to work, but simply cannot. This is where our society at large has significantly failed those who are in need from the mentally disabled to the physically disabled. It doesn’t make sense to tell someone one that is mentally ill to go get a job since they are incapable of holding one.

        Yes a mentally disabled person might be able to converse cogently in limited capacity, but that does not take into a holistic overview of their life that under examination would demonstrate issues that significantly interfere with executing the duties of a job. No one would reasonably expect a physically disabled person who is suffering from severe chronic pain to “Go get a job.”

        This doesn’t mean there are not people who abuse these benefits, but that doesn’t mean sweeping generalizations should be applied against all recipients of such benefits.

        All that being said I think the disability programs that exist are significantly insufficient. It’s my perception that public policy on this issue is typically driven by emotion and not scientific quantitative analysis.

        I think a nationwide educational awareness campaign covering issues (barriers and pain) disabled people encounter might be productive. It’s unlikely that such a campaign would ever happen.

      • chris968

        Ah yes, having a “limited perspective” that is certainly one good way to put it. Yes I am sick and tired of being accused of being “lazy” and “a deadbeat” and “abusing the system”. If I could work, I would be. I hate the fact that right now I am unable to. I was in and out of a psych hospital 8 times in the past two years and I am just only now starting to get my feet back on the ground. In my line of work you need to be mentally sound and prepared for anything as I work with teenagers with severe disabilities who are quite prone to violence. I am just incapable of doing so. But I really hope that one day (sooner rather than later) I will be able to get back into working. Right now it is just not safe for me to work because I wouldn’t be able to hold the job down anyway.

        People don’t believe I am disabled because I don’t have anything physical to show for it, which is bull. If someone is physically disabled because of their back, you can’t see what is wrong, yet that is okay. But people with mental health challenges are viewed differently, mainly because of the negative stigma that still surrounds mental health issues.

        And it seems so frequent with the Republican party all they want to do is cut benefits for the poor and disabled. You know, instead of taxing the wealthy. It sucks to be in this position, let me tell you that.

      • Brenda Mapp

        No I’ll leave that up to you , You don’t know my situation either so screw you Don’t expect me to help keep your ass up .I never said a damn thing about welfare either I said Social Security or do you not have enough sense to know the difference

      • chris968

        Wow you are a total b*tch. You have no place to tell me what to do I seem to have struck a nerve myself. You sound like a horrible person. How about you mind your own business and don’t judge others for the position they’re in. Again you don’t know my situation yet here you are telling me to “get a job”. You must be a Republican. When I worked I had no problem putting money into the system, you never know when you may need it yourself.

      • chris968

        And nowhere did I mention welfare to you. Apparently you can’t read.

    • miketothad

      Call yourself whatever you need.
      You’re a low-information “conservative” parrot.

      Most of you and “independents” are too civically and economically ignorant to know how to correctly classify yourselves.

      • annum004

        I do but it’s simply none of your business.

        Sorry if I busted your bubble.

      • miketothad

        LOL
        The sad part is that you folks are SO dumb, you believe you’re pulling one over on anybody.

      • annum004

        ????? Got me!!!

      • miketothad

        Of course.
        God knows you idiots don’t read, and don’t know what actual policy you support. GO ahead and wave your ignorance flag. Everybody knows it’s what you do.

      • annum004

        Ok, you stay on the “privileged” side of the Republic as I shoot for the Right.

      • miketothad

        lol
        I would tell you to read something and educate yourself, but I know that’s like kryptonite to you idiots.

      • annum004

        Try me, superman.

      • miketothad

        Nahhh… Get back to your Klan rally, Jethro.
        BP needs more tax breaks.

      • annum004

        ???Again, Got me!!!

      • frettadafrog

        “shoot for the “Rights”?
        Watch so you don’t shoot off your manhood with it.

    • wendy

      What if you lost your job, would you watch you kid starve too?

      • annum004

        I wouldn’t depend on a “job” or welfare to take care of my kid in the first place.

        Would you?

      • wendy

        Of course ‘most’ people don’t aspire to depend in welfare to feed their children.
        But in a dire emergency, if I had to either watch my kid starve or swallow a little pride, would be the latter.
        And if one shouldnt count on feeding their family by getting a job, how do u suggest they buy food for their family? Steal it?Now a paycheck is considered entitlement after a 40 + hr work week?

      • annum004

        Work your way up from welfare, to getting a job, to producing value for the society on your own volition.
        Produce more than you take.

      • wendy

        Its more like the middle class ARE producing more and taking /earning alot LESS because corporations are bleeding them dry by not giving many a living wage, thus more profit at their workers’ expense

      • annum004

        Right.

        So don’t sit there and let that happen, otherwise, settle for an insufficient welfare program and resort to “stealing” as you mentioned.

        Start from where you’re at, and climb out of these “stages” and go beyond State and corporate control over you.

        If you don’t do it, it wont happen.

      • wendy

        And to add, if you’ve been up to date with current affairs, people working 70 hr. weeks still cannot afford life. Cost have gone WAY up over the years. Many annual wages emulate what people were making in the 80’s. A living wage just might solve much of the welfare issues,; can agree at least on that?
        My opinion excludes any lazy shit abusing the system.
        Contrary to popular belief, practically anyone receiving help gets vilified as a lazy cheater.

      • annum004

        It’s a failed system, no doubt.

        More reason not to depend on it.

        An American produces value for the society.

        They don’t suck.

        They don’t depend on “Jack.”

      • Anson Brehmer

        Do you really believe this? America is not, in fact, the land of opportunity it bills itself as. The fact that there are people who work 40, 60, 80 hours a week and yet still have to rely on government assistance because the companies that they work for won’t pay them a livable wage should be ample proof of that. America is not a meritocracy. The people have been told it is, but “pulling yourself up by your bootstraps” is a myth. The bootstraps have all been cut. You might be comforted by the illusion that you worked your way up to whatever level of comfort you currently enjoy. But in America today who your parents were has more to do with your success than any efforts on your part. The color of your skin actually does matter more than the content of your character. It *shouldn’t* be that way, but that’s the society we’ve actually created here. The first step toward solving a problem is recognizing we have one. Claiming that “anyone can make it if they try,” that “an American produces value for society,” is just a pretty lie you’ve been telling yourself to avoid the ugly truth–the world is not a just place. Good people wind up in dire circumstances through no fault of their own. Bad people rise to the top with no effort of their own. This is *not* a just world–unless we, as a people, make it so. And the first step is to recognize who your true enemies are. And buddy, that’s not the poor fellow making do on $150 worth of food a month.

      • annum004

        More opportunity in America than any other place in the world.

        So take your pick.

        Get on the saddle and ride what you’ve got until she gets tamed to your desire.

      • Anson Brehmer

        Also a myth. There is nothing exceptional about America. Today, America has *less* opportunity than almost any other industrialized nation. Our social mobility is lower than most of Europe, lower than Scandinavia…hell, *Russia* has more social mobility than America today. Since 1980 the poor have gotten poorer, the middle class has shrunk and stagnated, and the top .1 are more wealthy than any people in the history of everything. Your cherished notion that America is somehow better than other nations, despite all evidence to the contrary, is part of the problem. And frankly, if I had the resources to move away, I *would.*

      • annum004

        Good for you.

      • strayaway

        Can we chip in?

      • R. Eilers

        Youre right about that but conservatives think it’s only blacks that are the lazy ones and whites just need a little help

      • R. Eilers

        EVERYONE depends on a job to support their kids

      • annum004

        Not true.

        Some people create jobs for those who never think outside of the box.

      • R. Eilers

        A job is a job whether you are employed self employed or an employer. Simply put if you work it’s a job

      • annum004

        Ok thanks.

    • R. Eilers

      Do you think welfare recipients live high on the hog? Did you know Texas pays an AVERAGE of $99 per welfare recipient a month? yeah that’s high on the hog alright. do you think anybody wants to live on food stamps? if you are receiving food stamps you surely are not living high on the hog

      • annum004

        That’s proof it doesn’t work.

      • R. Eilers

        what doesn’t work?

      • annum004

        Welfare… Isn’t that what you were talking about?

      • R. Eilers

        What does welfare need to accomplish to work? Since over 80% of ppl on welfare work it doesn’t need to support a family. Welfare doesn’t need to replace a job. Welfare is there to help struggling families through rough times.

      • annum004

        Ok, let’s hope they work their way out of welfare.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        Nearly 10% of welfare recipients work their way off the program every year. They “lift themselves up by their bootstraps” and find better jobs. Sadly the poverty rate doesn’t fall. To me this implies that while some are rising out of poverty, an equal number of people are falling into poverty.

      • annum004

        Good one Ernest.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        What conclusion would you draw then?

      • annum004

        I’m working on that with key people as we speak.

        Sorry my comment took so long above.

        Had to edit… Using a phone.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        Sorry if this seems blunt, but WTF are you talking about?

        Your comments might make sense to someone who is more familiar with your style of communication or with your situation, but without knowing who these people are or what exactly you are working on, they are meaningless. At least for me in this conversation.

      • annum004

        That’s only because of the evils at large.

        Would it be wise to display our only chance in hell, online, in front of the world, to both good and bad alike, the solution?

        Or would it be wise to hit the ground running?

        Of course I care, and hope people would take a peek at our own Republic.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        I must be drunk, I can’t make heads or tails out of your comments.

      • annum004

        Ok, thanks.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        So your goal is to be obtuse?

        That seems akin to trolling.

      • annum004

        Already said welfare and food stamps don’t work.

        Said too much after that.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        They keep people from going hungry and-or becoming homeless. It’s not perfect, but fuck, what is in this world?

      • annum004

        Learning from our mistakes.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        Agree.

        What in your opnion are our most gregarious mistakes?

      • annum004

        State Dependence for one.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        So we should return to tribal levels of organization?
        Self reliance seems like a grand illusion in light of the fact that we are all dependent on each other for survival.

        As an anthropologist I fully support smaller groups having autonomy, but short of massive violent revolution, I can’t see how we would go about such a massive change in our social structure. That being said, I would love to hear how you would go about creating a society less dependent on the impersonal bureaucracy that has come about.

      • annum004

        Branch off into the Right side of the Republic, keeping what we’ve got and feed into it.

  • SandyTodd

    Racism. You got it. Most of the people I know who think it’s “not government’s job to take care of people” are on food stamps themselves! OR – they’re busy figuring out how to hide their income so they can put a spouse on Medicaid. They would be perfectly happy to have these programs for white people. It’s those damn *insert racial epithet* that are the problem. White bigots act as if the rest of us white people are all in it with them, and say all kinds of crazy shit behind closed white doors. Then they’re shocked when we call them on it!

    • Brenda Mapp

      If you are talking about me Let me assure you I don’t care I never thru the race in any off it except to say illegals . true is true and it doesn’t matter who in hell it is Black, white purple or green and I don’t expect anything from the government except what I or my spouse put in

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        So you are bigoted, but only in regards to certain categories of people (immigrants in this case).

        Do you know what cognitive dissonance is?

      • miketothad

        “Liberal” fancy-talk.

      • Brenda Mapp

        I don’t think we should have to sit back and watch our government give away what we have put into it they want to help do it with welfare but don’t dare take it from people who have worked hard to have something when they get old.If you don’t you don’t get it. If thats being bigot then yes hell I am if you think so .I don’t care who you are

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        Gosh, when I read your response I can’t help but feel sad for you. Nearly all Americans live a life of luxury compared to other countries around the world. You might want to think that you are more entitled to live here than other people, but your family immigrated here too. (unless you’re a full blooded Native American) In reality Hispanics have more right to live here than descendants of Europeans who murdered most of the inhabitants and stole the land via colonization.

      • Brenda Mapp

        Don’t feel sorry for me ,I never said i was more intitled than anyone else. Are you old enough for social security If not you don’t have no Idea how i believe or think .worry about your self and if you want to hand over everything you have work for then go right ahead..I don’t intend on giving everything to those who would sit on their butt and wait for others to dish out to them .Helping someone in time of need is a hell of a long way than just handing out to the free loaders

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        “Don’t feel sorry for me ,I never said i was more intitled than anyone else.”

        You don’t have to come out and say it, the subtext (or implied meaning) of your comments clearly demonstrates your entitlement.

        “Are you old enough for social security If not you don’t have no Idea how i believe or think ”

        Unless I’m mistaken about how communication works, you’re using words to describe how you feel and think. Isn’t that why your commenting? so you can impart others with how you feel and think?

        “I don’t intend on giving everything to those who would sit on their butt and wait for others to dish out to them”

        Immigrants are usually much harder working than other Americans, that’s why they get hired in favor of citizens.

        “.Helping someone in time of need is a hell of a long way than just handing out to the free loaders”

        less than .01% of welfare cases are fraudulent, Your using the outlier (the one out of 1,000) and pretending its the norm to justify your position.

      • strayaway

        Actually, according to National Geographic genotype evidence, so called Native Americans came here in at least six waves from areas as diverse as SE Asia to near the Urals. They were not related to each other. Only the descendants of the first wave have a right to imagine that they are more entitled to be here than the others.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        Perhaps I should clarify why I brought up that there were people living here in the Americas long before European colonization. Brenda’s comments seemed to be based on the assumption that she is more entitled to live in the U.S. than other groups, whose ancestors in all likelihood inhabited this continental long before her ancestors immigrated here. I’m sorry if you interpreted my comment to imply that only the very first groups that immigrated here are enittled to live here to the exclusion of all others. That was not my intent.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        As an anthropologist I would love to see that study. I knew there were several linguistical families in pre-colonial North America, and that would imply separate migrations, but I had no idea there was some hard evidence to back up that theory.

        “They were not related to each other.”

        Of course they were related to each other, all humans are related to each other, Its a matter of degrees of separation, not separate classifications.

        “so called Native Americans”

        What exactly are you implying here?

      • strayaway

        To find the “Genographic” study, go to National Geographic’s site or see the Wikipedia article titled “Genographic Project”. Over 700,000 people around the world have participated. I find the study exciting. These genetic tests put a light on pre-history particularly the migrations of people. The English, for instance, are not as Anglo-Saxon in origin as we were long led to believe.

        Re your question- “so called” I was pounding on the fact that our simplistic understanding that all Native American ancestors sort of came over the Bering Strait and are related. Not so. At least one group originated in SE Asia while another group has some genetic material in common with Europeans indication that they had some common roots. Sioux Indians measure the highest on that count. I forget which tribe but one of the SE US tribes has genetic material in common with Eskimos. These groups may have come over thousands of years apart and not necessarily all over a land bridge. Whichever group came over first gets credit for being true Native Americans. Europeans were just a much later wave of invaders.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        ” I was pounding on the fact that our simplistic understanding that all
        Native American ancestors sort of came over the Bering Strait and are
        related.”

        This might be your understanding, but archaeologists know better.

        “Whichever group came over first gets credit for being true Native Americans.”

        Nice opinion, it reflects your first come first serve selfish worldview, which is not shared by most of the world.

      • strayaway

        But the Indians’ ancestors came here over thousands of years from diverse places. For someone claiming to be an anthropologist, you seem to have a static view of world history. If The Indians were here first, wouldn’t you also have to support the Zionist claim to Israel, or the Serbian claim to Kosovo? Do English people have a claim to the Jutland peninsula in Denmark where the Jutes came from? Much of the rest of the world is ruled by dictatorships so I am not enamored by what they think.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        Ignorance abounds I suppose.

        Zionism is another form of colonialism, There never was a pre-historic Hebrew state, no king David, no temple of Solomon, hell slaves didn’t even build the pyramids.

        ” wouldn’t you also have to support the Zionist claim to Israel, or the
        Serbian claim to Kosovo? Do English people have a claim to the Jutland
        peninsula in Denmark where the Jutes came from?”

        What about all humans are one people don’t you understand?

        Colonialism is the opposite of equality and freedom, its the subversion of one group for the benefit of another.

      • strayaway

        “What about all humans are one people don’t you understand?”

        I understand it to be pretty much a cliche. You don’t even want to take the locks off of your doors to allow your fellow humans in need to help themselves to your private property. I don’t either but I’m not pretending to be something I’m not.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        “I understand it to be pretty much a cliche”

        Unity is an overused idea in this divided world? You don’t even know what a cliche is it seems…..

        “You don’t even want to take the locks off of your doors to allow your
        fellow humans in need to help themselves to your private property”

        oversimplification.

        ” I don’t either but I’m not pretending to be something I’m not.”

        Tell me o’ great reader of minds, what am I pretending to be exactly.

        Your arguments seem to be predicated on fallacy, perhaps you should rethink your position.

      • strayaway

        You are pretending to be magnanimous by getting rid of borders so everyone who wanted to come in could do so. Meanwhile, you lock your doors to hoard your processions so you still maintain an edge over the masses.

      • strayaway

        Edited to add: Of course we are all related to each other. That is both true and has a nice kumbaya ring to it. However, I was speaking in relative terms and did not clarify that.

      • chris968

        So you don’t believe that people who are poor should receive benefits from the government? They should just remain homeless and hungry?

      • strayaway

        If our leaders of both parties would stop sending our jobs abroad and bringing in cheap labor to replace more expensive US workers, there wouldn’t be as many homeless and hungry Americans and we could do a better job of taking care of those who need help.

        Just NAFTA has resulted in “a staggering $181 billion U.S. trade deficit with NAFTA partners Mexico and Canada and the related loss of 1 million net U.S. jobs under NAFTA, growing income inequality, displacement of more than one million Mexican campesino farmers and a doubling of desperate immigration from Mexico.” -Huffington Post 3/8/14

        Republicans are partly responsible but so are Democratic presidents who signed NAFTA into law and tried to hand out 4-5M work permits for illegal aliens.

      • chris968

        I worked a full-time job with health benefits in a school district that only paid me $16,400 and I worked my ass off and should have been getting paid double that. I got approved for food stamps while working full time. There are many more factors than just outsourced jobs and cheap labor.

      • strayaway

        Yes, there are many other factors. However, a labor shortage allows workers to DEMAND higher wages and better benefits. That is supply/demand 101. Sending millions of jobs abroad while bringing in millions of cheaper foreign workers to replace higher paid US workers has the opposite effect. If you and other teacher assistants and teachers had other higher paying employment options, your school system would be forced to pay teacher assistants more. Meanwhile you are, as you say, cheap labor.

      • … Except that if you are looking for work for years you cannot expect to decide your pay. You have to take what you can get because it could be years more before you find employment. Your reasoning is backwards.

      • strayaway

        I am simply applying the law of supply and demand to the effects of sending jobs abroad while importing more cheap foreign domestic labor. Yes, we have to take what we get and shouldn’t hope for more under those circumstances.

      • After I posted my original comment I reread your comment and realized that I had misread it the first time. I apologize. We are on the same page, for the most part. (I did try and negotiate my salary. The guy asked me what the minimum was I could live on. I refused to answer. He refused to pay. I finally gave in and gave him the absolute minimum I could live on. He took $200 a week off of that amount and I have had my utilities shut off from time to time since. Nope. No negotiating.)

      • Flat Banana

        This is something you could’ve changed.

      • chris968

        Not true, not when it was the only job available, and then I fell quite ill and ended up on disability. Try not judging others.

      • Flat Banana

        Oh so now you add that in there. Depending on how long you were at this job before you got sick you could’ve kept looking for another position. There are jobs everywhere, you just have to look and be or become qualified. The world isn’t full of handouts like most want it to be.

      • chris968

        Wow why am I not surprised people judging me without even knowing me. If I could work, I would. Kind of hard to work or attend school to become more qualified when I am unable to do either. You just can’t accept the fact that some people are unable to work. But you don’t know my situation and you never will, so I suggest you stop talking now.

      • CharInOhio

        Chris, you stated several times in your posts that the job you had ………..You “only” got paid x amount of money and did “way more work” that it was worth …… then, you claimed you got ill but wasnt “disabled” ……..then in another post you claim you were getting “disability” ……which is it ? Dont you know people read back and forwards on these blogs? Seriously? Obviously, you had a “problem” with working to begin with …….so perhaps acting sicker than you actually were …served you well for freebies ? Just a thought ………

      • chris968

        WTF are you talking about? I became very ill causing me to become disabled. Is that hard for you to wrap your mind around? If I could be working I would be but I can’t. Hopefully someday I will be able to go back to work. Fuck you.

      • Argument Clinic

        No average citizen can change the economic wage slave system we have. The people you are berating about it can’t do anything about it. You’re preaching to the wrong choir. What do you suggest we do?

      • Sonia Stafford

        “so now you add that in there”??? that was in the original post, try reading. You don’t know this person or anything about the job environment where they live. The world isn’t full of decent wage jobs, like some claim.

      • Sam Trevino

        You stated, “The world isn’t full of handouts like most want it to be.” That’s not true. If you happen to be a large corporation that is classified as “Too Big to Fail” you can obtain significant corporate welfare at the expense of tax payers.

      • Exactly right. But these people that want families crying and dying of starvation on their doorsteps because they are forced to beg for food seem to believe corporate welfare is just fine. Maybe they think the corporations are going to feed them when it is their turn to starve. After all these people are immune to hard ships so they get special status.

      • Argument Clinic

        I don’t believe corporations are paying their fair share and they are gaming the system but even if you funneled all their money to the people, it wouldn’t satisfy everyone’s needs not by a long shot. The problem is really BAD. All I can tell you is that I came from a blue collar working family and I figured out how to make a decent living for myself by making smart choices, working hard and pulling myself up by my boot straps. It wasn’t easy and I worked really hard to get where I’m at. The fact that you would take my hard efforts and appropriate them for your benefit is disgusting. I’m pretty sure if I could do what I did then you could too. I had VERY humble beginnings. I was dirt poor when I was younger. I didn’t get any special status and I didn’t get any handouts. I hit the bricks. You have no idea how wrong you are if you think people like me have some “special status”. I had to figure out some really challenging shit in this stupid economic system to get where I’m at today.

      • Argument Clinic

        The amount of money that corporations are holding pales in comparison to the national debt. Even if they forked it all over to pay down the debt we’d still be about $18 trillion in debt. The idea that would actually fix everyone’s problems is liberal fantasy. It’s the same idea as if we all stopped burning fossil fuels right now the polar ice caps would re-freeze. Liberals are not dealing with reality.

        Liberals are good at pointing out problems and complaining. Not so good about coming up with real solutions to real problems.

      • JoAnne Warehime

        Where do you live that there are jobs everywhere? The job market here is bad. There are 7 applications for every 1 job. The only time there is really any work is in the spring and early summer. Most jobs go to younger people on summer break cause they can pay them less

      • CharInOhio

        You say in another post you were really sick but “not disabled” ………so you were on disability but were NOT disabled ? Thanks for verifying that 🙂 Least you could do …..is keep your poor little me stories straight ? Sheesh ….

      • chris968

        Go fuck yourself

      • R. Eilers

        Could have changed for better or worse. Changing jobs ensures nothing

      • Flat Banana

        Improving education and technical skills can last a lifetime. If you have a job that anyone could do then you wont receive the high pay you want, example being fast food worker.

      • R. Eilers

        sure, if you have the time money and opportunity to do that. what if I have a full time job and two kids to raise? I guess I could not sleep

      • Flat Banana

        There are ways to do it, there are thousands of military members who work 40-60hr weeks, have a family, and go to school online. You have to want it, if you don’t then it wont work.

      • R. Eilers

        I agree there are ways to do it. I’m just saying one size does not fit all.

      • Argument Clinic

        That’s the sad thing we live in an economic system that couldn’t care less about whether we have kids or not which ultimately will make us go extinct.

      • Donna Parsons

        or you could go to law school accrue $40,000 in debt and find a job at a prestigious law firm and STILL MAKE ONLY 25,000 a year.

      • Argument Clinic

        it’s more like $100,000 for law school but most paralegals make $35k-40k starting out.

      • Argument Clinic

        Not necessarily when we are paying immigrant workers half the wages to do the same jobs but much lower quality. You’re better off having good in-demand skills but the corporations are working around that with open borders and free trade agreements. They don’t want to pay those of us that put the hard work and effort into our skills a fair wage.

      • CharInOhio

        IF your ONE job is not enough , you get a 2nd one ……sorry , that is how it works. OR FIND A BETTER ONE ……I had a County job that didnt pay me much more than what you claim , paid for every dime of my benefits and into pension too …..nothing was “free” by far ……it was full time but I had to work part time too ………to make ends meet ……….so what you are telling me is …………..You feel “too good” to HAVE to work a 2nd job cause you feel you don’t make enough money to live how you want ? So you want ME, who makes about the same as you did …to pay for YOUR food ? Sorry …………..NO ……

      • chris968

        Who the fuck are you? Shut the fuck up asshole.

      • bobby smith

        You pay jack squat for her food you righteous hillbilly

        You want someone to steal from you or go homeless then? ?

        Why aren’t you mad at TRUMP for not paying 900 million in taxes? ? While he has 7 BILLION

        because he STARTED OFF RICH IN WHITE TOWN.

        What your bred seems to never comprehend is how the world works. Who really is taking your money.

        And how inequality is engineered. Not everyone has a fair shake and I know $35 a month so some family somewhere can survive for a year is a great idea.

        Or that money goes to a road or school.

        What goes around comes around so take all your white buddies and jump off a cliff and let me and the rest of the liberals actually fight for a better world for all people.

      • Argument Clinic

        I suppose if you had been born in a hunter gatherer society where danger was really high of getting eaten by a predator you would complain about not having safety except there’d be no one to complain to. Actually, you wouldn’t even exist because of survival of the fittest. The sense of entitlement is strong in this one. The universe owes you nothing snowflake.

      • Yes! I work in management full time. After college I tried and tried to find work but was told I had no experience. After years I took the first management job that I could. My employer does not believe in minimum wage so I earn per hour less than I did after high school in a pizzeria. I can’t quit until I have enough “experience” to get hired elsewhere so here I am… on food stamps. These people are clueless. They think it is so simple and cannot fathom the concept of “variables.” (Wish I could live in a fantasy world.)

      • miketothad

        False-equivalence horseshit.

      • strayaway

        How so? Which facts are false?

      • miketothad

        You present them as though they are Democratic policy, and as if they in any way compare to the scale of GOP policy of wholesale deregulation, Citizens United, and opposition to campaign finance oversight. You’re nowhere close and your argument is lazy.

      • strayaway

        What I was suggesting was that true believers who make the less than profound case “Republican bad, Democrat good” should look at the numbers showing that the US working class and especially black Americans have suffered as much or more under Obama as under Bush. I think Democrats believe their policies work and have noble intentions of sharing their neighbors’ wealth but if the medicine isn’t working….blaming Republicans isn’t going to do much good while poor Americans are going down the drain. Is Citizens Untied doing anything to stop millions of corporate and foreign plutocrat dollars from going into the Clinton Foundation? If it isn’t, it should. I noticed that you didn’t dispute any of my statistic that you previously referred to as “False-equivalence horseshit”.

      • miketothad

        What you’re suggesting is bullshit. You’re unspecific about policy, completely full of shit on policy consequences, you’re trying to pin blame on Obama for the results of trickle-down policy, and now you want to roll out Clinton Foundation conspiracy theory bullshit. I blame idiots like you for G W. Bush.

      • strayaway

        No, What I am saying is statistically true. May I remind you that Obama has been president for seven years, the Senate and House were also Democratic for two of those years, and the Senate has been Democratic for 6 of those seven years.It’s a little late in the game to be blaming seven year of Obama on Bush. Truman said, “The buck stops here”. Obama supporters say blame it on Bush. Remember Senator Obama leaving the campaign trail to lobby for Bush’s Wall Street bailout, transferring bad paper from banks to taxpayers at their full price on 12/26/09, running up the national debt 60% more than Bush so far, and making half of Bush’s expiring tax breaks for the rich permanent? This week, Obama is promoting fast tracking the TPP; a huge gift to the US Chamber of Commerce. Senators can only read what is isn it under lock and key and are not allowed by the guards to take notes or repeat what they have read to constitutents. All this under the most transparent presidency ever. The Clinton foundation is no conspiracy. It exists. Rich Saudis and at least one Ukraine oligarch contributed at least $15.3M to the Clinton Foundation while Hillary was Secretary of State. At least you can vote for Sanders in the primary to keep yourself from smelling for awhile.

        “We came out of the White House not only dead broke but in debt. We had no money when we got there, and we struggled to, you know, piece together the resources for mortgages for houses, for Chelsea’s education. You know, it was not easy.” -Hillary Clinton

      • miketothad

        The deficit has decreased by half under Obama. You’re as ignorant as a teabagger.

      • strayaway

        I said “debt” not “deficit”. Obama’s debt is the accumulation of his annual deficits. People spend dollars not percentages. Obama’s $8T debt equals $25,397 of debt for every man, woman, and child in America. Even if we don’t pay it off right away, it is a ball and chain Obama is putting on our children. So while the next generation of Chinese children will be reaping the benefits of the investment of China’s surplus, our next generation will be paying interest on Obama’s mismanagement; Bush’s too but Obama’s debt is already 60% larger. If a father drank up his paycheck after work on Friday so there was no food at home it might be called child abuse but when Obama rings up a $25,397 tab for each of us, your comment is that at least he doesn’t drink as much as he used too. That’s really a pathetic talking point.

      • miketothad

        Debt/deficit. take your pick. Once again you’re trying to pin the catastrophic results of W’s policies on someone else with your word salad. You’re pathetically full of crap.

      • strayaway

        Obama’s $8T increase in the federal debt is the sum of all his annual deficits equalling $25.397 per American. How are you planning to pay down your share or are you just hoping our kids get stuck paying for Obama’s bills. Even “teabaggers” as you refer to them understand the difference between debt and deficit better than you seem to.

      • miketothad

        Squirm between the debt and deficit title you wish to use, if you wish.
        The deficit/debt you parrot about now didn’t exist until your idiot base let lose your stupidity on the White House – something you won’t be seeing the inside of for decades.

      • strayaway

        Hey, I’m no supporter of Bush. He was a big spending big government Republican. But in the matter of spending and running us into debt, Obama outperforms even Bush. I can give you a better talking point though than repeating the ‘cut the deficit in half nonsense’. Try this. Look up Reagan’s accumulated debt and apply the inflation index to it. Adjusted for inflation, Reagan ran the country into debt more than Bush and about as bad as Obama. Again, Reagan was a big spending Republican. Not all Republicans hold a candle to Coolidge or Harding for that matter.

      • miketothad

        LOL…. of COURSE you’re a Bush apologist/supporter. You support the exact same policies, and you’re too ignorant know it. Go on with all your Reagan gibberish. Your GOP doesn’t give a rat’s ass about spending… parrot.

      • strayaway

        I was giving you a helping hand trying to improve the quality of your posts. I lean constitutional libertarian in my politics, Bush, Reagan and Obama do not. I realize that in you little world of “Republican bad, Democrat good”, you are not able to accommodate the libertarian/authoritarian dimension so I guess I don’t expect you to comprehend what I am talking about.

      • miketothad

        Call yourself whatever you wish. Fiscally, you’re a willfully ignorant right wing parrot.

      • strayaway

        Since you have no idea that I voted for school millage increases the last two times I’ve had the option and support quality state and local universities, roads, education, libraries, and many other services, You are an idiot for venturing out with an an assumed and incorrect assumption. It seems as if you have run out of useful debate points and have lapsed into the world of stereotypes and assumptions but perhaps that is all you are capable of.

      • miketothad

        Don’t cry, bagger.

      • strayaway

        You aren’t improving your status as a quality poster with that post. “Tea bagging”, by the way, refers to a sexual practice understood better among liberals and presumably, as suggested by your repeated mentions of it, yourself.

      • miketothad

        And you’re improving your status, trolling in defense of the GOP scam? lol

      • R. Eilers

        sorry, but who gave Obama that deficit? Bush came into office with a surplus and handed Obama a TRILLION dollar deficit! Obama had to fix Bush’s Great Recession AND pay off Bush’s wars before he could bring the deficit down. Try again

      • strayaway

        Obama left the campaign trail to lobby for Bush’s almost $1T Wall Street bankers bailout. Once in office, Obama pushed through an almost as big Porkulus bill that had been largely stripped of infrastructure money and retroactively added some billions of dollars of new spending in Bush’s final budget.. Although Obama promised on the campaign trail that he would end the Iraq war immediately, he kept it going until one month before the Iraqi parliament had ordered US troops out. He has since sent back more US troops. All of this costs money. Obama did not pay off Bush’s war. He extended it and raised its cost. Also, adding $8T to the federal debt after raising some additional tax money by eliminating half of Bush’s temporary tax cuts for the rich and making the other half permanent largely papered over how bad the economy is. That spending hasn’t been repaid.

        Truman: The buck stops here.
        Obama supporters: It’s Bush’s fault

      • R. Eilers

        No, Obama did not leave the campaign trail to push Bush’s agenda which was a 400 billion dollar bailout that didn’t work. Obama’s 780 billion dollar bailout worked. Go ahead and cry about the petty stuff, Obama got us out of both of Bush’s wars he couldn’t finish himself. The Federal debt is Bush’s trillion dollars deficits handed to Obama. Face it Bush sucked and you know it.

      • strayaway

        I didn’t say that. Senator Obama left the campaign trail to lobby the black lobby to vote for Bush’s Wall Street bankers bailout. Obamas’s Porkulus was a failure. Little was built.

        “The price tag for the Wall Street bailout is often put at $700 billion—the size of the Troubled Assets Relief Program. But TARP is just the tip of the iceberg of money paid out or set aside by the Treasury Department and Federal Reserve.” -Mother Jones

        Obama did not get us out of bush’s wars. While Bush was still President, the Iraqi Parliament ordered US troops out by a certain day. Obama kept the troops in Iraq until just one month before that deadline although he had promised to take them out immediately. We are still in Afghanistan and many more troops have been killed there under Obama than under Bush. Obama recently sent in some troops to Iraq too.

        Yes, Bush sucked. So does Obama. i think they should be sharing a prison cell together. You can’t grasp the continuity of Bush and Obama’s wars and helping banksters. Bush had nothing to do with the mess Obama contributed to in Libya. I’ll give Obama credit though for being the only president who has bombed seven countries and still won a Nobel Peace Prize.

      • Anson Brehmer

        Amen. What a disappointment he’s turned out to be.

      • R. Eilers

        So under your guidelines we are still at war in Iraq and Afghanistan because we have troops there? Then we are still at war with Germany, Korea and Japan too. Listen carefully, Obama got us out of Bush’s wars. How many ppl died in Bush’s wars compared to Obama is irrelevant. It’s still Bush’s wars that he didn’t finish

      • strayaway

        Americans are still getting killed in Afghanistan. Obama just sent US advisors into Iraq. I’m all for taking US troops out of Germany, S. Korea, and Japan where, unlike Afghanistan and Iraq no wars are going on and those countries are rich enough to beef up and expand their own militaries. please reread my last post. Obama did not get us out of Iraq and Afghanistan. The Iraqi government forced us to leave and we are still in Afghanistan. Senator Obama always supported Bush’s wars until they became his own. I supported the intrusion into Afghanistan to subdue the Taliban after 9/11. The problem was that after the Taliban was chased out of Afghanistan, the US under both Bush and Obama suffered mission creep. Obama has bombed seven countries. His North African Arab spring adventure has been a US foreign policy disaster as was Obama’s meddling in the Ukraine. One thing Obama did do successfully was to bring back the cold war with Russia.

      • miketothad

        strayaway is ignorant and proud.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        Now here you are moving the goalposts. After trying to put forth the idea that Obama the president is responsible for the bank bailout, and war debt that Bush II refused to put on the books you change your line of argument.

        Now somehow, Obama the senator is responsible for the Bush II policies.

        Its sad really that instead of objectively looking at the facts, that you try to cram them into a narrative that fits your agenda.

        Fortunately such obvious inconsistencies are easy to point out, unfortunately I fear that you have no desire to recognize them as such.

      • strayaway

        Obama is not solely responsible. I didn’t suggest that. He is “also” responsible. As Senator, he did, indeed, support Bush’s wars and Wall Street bailout. This isn’t just my agenda. His votes can be looked up. He is presently trying to lock us into the TPP. Bush had nothing to do with that. Listen to Sanders or Warren. Obama is just another corporatist butt-boy when big money is involved. Really, now is the time to be supporting Sanders for all you are worth or you will be saddled to Hillary and the Bush/Obama corporatist legacy will continue. Need I say that Jeb wouldn’t be any better?

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        “He is “also” responsible”

        I never claimed you said he was solely responsible.

        Your argument is so weak you have to lie about my position to defend it

        That should be a huge red flag.

      • strayaway

        Which statistic or fact that I presented do you disagree with? Go ahead and praise Obama for supporting the TPP because that is what he is about, other than fund raising, this week. It just caps his legacy of fronting for the banksters.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        Strawman galore, I’m a Bernie man myself. But keep convincing yourself you can read minds. SMFH

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        It’s funny that you happen to mention the Clinton foundation. I did a report on them for my NGO class. While it is true that they receive millions in donations from all over the globe, they are an American not-for-profit and as such submit a 990-c tax form every year. These can be viewed here : http://www.guidestar.org/organizations/31-1580204/william-j-clinton-foundation.aspx#forms-docs

        I spent several hours entering the data available for my analysis of the organization and found only a few minor discrepancies. If you can find some indications of corruption or gross negligence by all means point them out. Its better to present facts than vague implications of misconduct. The former must be considered, the latter, lacking evidence, can be dismissed out of hand.

      • strayaway

        Accepting $8.3M from a Ukraine oligarch and $7M from rich Saudis while being Secretary of State is, in the real world, a conflict of interest. More recent allegations have come up that $75M was contributed to the foundation by someone who had uranium interests that the State department ok’ed. Remember, this is the lady who made partner at the Rose Law firm exactly when her husband became Governor. This was the lady who turned $1,000 into $100,000 in her first shot on the futures market. She has amazingly good luck. But the circumstantial evidence is piling up that all this coincidence is more than coincidence. Now Chelsea has a job at the Foundation which, last I heard, only distributes 15% of its take with amazing amounts going to transportation, salaries, etc.. That’s ok. There are probably less efficient foundations elsewhere but Hillary should have resigned as Secretary of State when her foundation was accepting huge amounts from countries the Department of State had a hand in.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        You are making baseless allegations. I have done actual research, I even provided you with information, yet to refuse to even consider it.

      • strayaway

        We will see if the allegations are baseless if Hillary doesn’t lose more of her emails. Circumstantially, Hillary looks like an evil crook. The more that comes out on the news on an almost daily basis about Hillary, the less reassuring your claims seem.

        Besides, Article 1, Section 9 forbids government officials from accepting presents and emoluments. Hillary was shoveling money into her trust donated by oil shieks while Secretary of State. That is an outright violation of the Constitution.

        “no Person holding any Office of Profit or Trust under (the United States), shall, without the Consent of the Congress, accept of any present, Emolument, Office, or Title, of any kind whatever, from any King, Prince, or foreign State.”

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        You clearly don’t understand how charity’s like the Clinton foundation work, the money is not Hilliary’s and where its spent is laid out in the 990 forms provided to the IRS every year.

        The Clinton foundation spends over 250 million dollars every year on projects all over the world. That might seem like the doings of an “evil crook”to you, but to the rest of the world they use a different word…
        Humanitarian.

      • strayaway

        It’s technically not Hillary’s. Do you mean like trusts are legally different from the people who control them? They even gave Chelsea a job at the Foundation. I don’t know what she makes but it will probably be enough to make the payments on her new $10.5M apartment. Chelsea’s last phony job paid $600,000 at NBC.

        While the Foundation claims that 88$ of its money goes into life saving work the breakdown for 2013 shows 34% went to other expenses, 33% went to salaries and benefits, 2% went to IT, office supplies 6%, rent5%. travel 10%, and 10% WENT TO CHARITABLE GRANTS. In short, it’s a money laundering organization.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        ” Do you mean like trusts are legally different from the people who control them?”

        The board of trustees decides what projects the money is spent on.

        ” I don’t know what she makes”

        Now you got it. First honest comment you’ve made.

        ” 10% WENT TO CHARITABLE GRANTS.”

        They don’t focus on grants, they focus on projects, like building schools and wells, creating araible cropland, relocating human trafficking victims, health programs, and a laundry list of other projects. To accomplish these things they pay people to go overseas and do them. They purchase infrastructure like wells and buildings that they then donate to the community after they leave.

        I spent half a semester investigating compiling a report on this NGO.
        Others in the class compiled others. NGOs like the United Way and The March of Dimes are have questionable and borderline unethical practices, why don’t you investigate them and see what you come up with?

        If you have any questions, I would love to clear up these misconceptions you have.

      • strayaway

        I choose not to give to the United Way but one difference is that the United Way has no connection to a government official giving favors to donors contrary to the Constitution.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        What favors?

      • strayaway

        There has been a lot in the news lately regarding contributors to the Clinton Foundation getting favorable rulings or support from the State Department. Its a way of saying thank you like having Hillary show up and make $225,000 speeches. At least 181 donors who contributed to the Clinton Foundation while Hillary was SOS lobbied the Sate department. Look up the NY Times article, “Cash Flowed to Clinton Foundation Amid Russian Uranium Deal” for the details of one such donation/lobbying effort.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        What favors did you mention again? If there is “lots of news” you should have no problem comming up with a concrete example, with the evidence to support it.

      • strayaway

        Why don’t you just read the NY Times article and find out its concerns. Of course if you believe open borders will be a positive experience for US workers, then you probably believe Hillary is a saint whatever the circumstantial evidence.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        First off you claimed you had evidence of favors, when pressed you retracted-reworded your claim to “lots of news”. One article is not “lots of news”.

        I don’t care about the effects of immigration not benifiting one group since I don’t buy into nationalistic ideology.

        “Whatever the circumstantial evidence”
        Circumstantial evidence is an oxymoron, it’s not evidence of anything other than a conspiracy theory

      • strayaway

        One glance of NY Times opinions outweighs any of yours. If you don’t buy into nationalist ideology and borders, you obviously don’t support the Constitution. Circumstantial evidence is like Hillary squirreling millions of foreign dollars into closely held foundations, destroying their emails, and saying “what, who me, I didn’t do anything”. Circumstantial evidence is the little kid with frosting all over his face saying the same thing.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        So appeal to athority, strawman, conjecture, and inaccurate metaphores. Anymore fallacies you want to bust out?

      • strayaway

        “Authorities” is spelled with a “U”.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        My misspelling a word doesn’t make your arguments less fallacious. Nice try though.

      • strayaway

        You misspelled one word in two separate posts. More is expected from someone who claims to be so highly educated.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        Educated people never make spelling errors? Weakest trolling ever.

      • strayaway

        Google “Hillary favors” if you need more than one article.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        First: if you make a claim the onus is on you to provide evidence. Second, Google is not an acredited source.

      • strayaway

        Google links us to accredited sources. (Accredited has two “c’s”) I’m surprised you didn’t learn that at university.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        No it doesn’t, it links to the Web, which is full of unaccredited sources. Unless you’re referring to Google scholar, in which case all I need is the DOI number to verify the authenticity.

      • strayaway

        Do you have any idea how ridiculous you sound? First, you called the NY Times article about Hillary “opinion” preferring your own opinions. You criticized my having only providing one link regarding Hillary’s improprieties when you asked for one so I suggested you Google “Hillary favors”to find more similar articles. Now you are criticizing Google for linking to the web because “Google is not an accredited source”. Killing the messenger, Google, isn’t going to make all the bad press about Hillary go away.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        More lies out of the peanut gallery. First you never linked a times piece, you said there was one, then never produced it insisting I do your work for you. Second one article isn’t “lots of sources” you’re just being disenginous. Third pointing out that fox news and breitbart and the young conservitves are non accredited news sources isn’t “killing the messenger” it’s pointing out that they lack the standards that are required to be considered legitimate journalism.

      • strayaway

        Google is a LINK to accredited sources.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        Then you should have no problems providing the DOI numbers.

      • strayaway

        It looks and smells like a scam to me. I don’t think the emperor has a wondrous set of clothes either.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        “It looks and smells like a scam to me.”

        Then you should educate yourself.

      • strayaway

        I have educated myself. That’s why i don’t say naive thing like you.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        Yet simple grammer rules elude you, where is your degree from again?

      • strayaway

        Did i say I have a degree? You should get a refund from whatever finishing school you attended, It seems to have the unfortunate effect of making you seem snotty and naive.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        You said you had educated yourself, since the university is where one obtains an education, it’s pretty natural to assume that you attended one. It’s amazing that you consider me snotty and naive after I showed how uniformed you actually are. It’s really just an ad hominim fallacy, which you would know about if you were “educated”

      • strayaway

        Once again, you prove what an arrogant snot you are imagining that “the university is where one obtains an education.” In your small world there is one way; your way. Most of us learn all through our lives, on our jobs, from people shooting at us, from lovers but you, sad one, missed all that.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        You learn throughout your life I totaly agree, but that is not the same as being educated by the university. You can’t get a job by claming you’ve been shot at and therefore have just as much knowledge as someone who has spent 4 or more years focusing on a field of study.
        My point is that you are misrepresenting yourself when you claim you have an education (which has an implied definition whether or not you want to admit it) and you lack the creditials to back it up.

        Most of these concepts you are arguing for in this thread have been discussed and debated ad nausum over the last few hundred (and in some cases thousands) years. Your misguided views have been debunked by hundreds of studied.

      • strayaway

        It sounds like you were programmed at whichever university you went to. In your previous post you wrote “”the university is where one obtains an education.” Now you are backing off and agree that “you learn throughout your life”. You abhor “circumstantial evidence” but use an “implied definition”. Would you be anything looking into a mirror without those credentials you bought? You should Google, “Hillary favors”.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        Programmed? Just like your doctor’s and lawyers.
        You can obtain a high school education, a college education, a vo-tech education. It’s not backing off, it’s pointing out a distinction between two very different things.
        I don’t “abhor” anything (more supposition by you) but I do understand that circumstantial evidence is conjecture and carries no real weight (in scientific journals nor the courts).
        If words didn’t have definitions we would be unable to communicate at all.

        I paid for the right to go to school, but I earned the degree with hard work. Your jealousy and personal attacks will never change that.

        If all the evidence you have is “Google it” your argument must be pretty weak.

      • strayaway

        Perhaps if you lump yourself in with doctors some of it will rub off. I’m thinking about the old Charlie Tuna add where Charlie confuses good taste with tasting good. Doctors are secure enough though that they don’t have to remind people of their degrees.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        That’s why they carry the title of doctor. So people know they are one. Are you so clueless that you don’t even recognize the purpose of titles?

      • strayaway

        I expect you to henceforth refer to candidates Ben Carson and Rand Paul as Doctor Carson and Doctor Paul. Hillary, while no doctor, however, seems to be in conflict with the “Title of Nobility” clause for accepting presents and emoluments from foreign donors benefitting from State Department rulings as Secretary of State that found their way into her Foundation coffers. $250,000 speeches to her biggest contributors Citicorps and Goldman Sachs also look like a money laundering scam.

        Article I, Section 9, Clause 8:

        No title of nobility shall be granted by the United States: and no person holding any office of profit or trust under them, shall, without the consent of the Congress, accept of any present, emolument, office, or title, of any kind whatever, from any king, prince, or foreign state.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        Show me on the 990 form where she recived those funds. SMFH

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        You’re the one who lied about being educated.

      • strayaway

        Quote me on what I said “about being educated”.

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        You said your were educated, then when I inquired where? You backtracked and claimed your education came from living life.
        Try getting into a graduate program with your “education”

      • Ernest Crunkleton

        He didn’t say what you said was factually false, he said it was a false equivalency. One is a lie, the other a fallacy. He pointed out that your argument was based on a comparison of two parties as if they existed free from circumstantial and contextual differences. They are not “the same”, they are in fact dramatically different and equating them as similar is disingenuous at best.

      • CharInOhio

        UNLESS YOU ARE elderly or TRULY disabled , and I dont mean saying you have carpal tunnel syndorme and cannot do any work for life or something ……I mean , seriously something is wrong with you physically keeping you from doing ANY WORK ……..you SHOULD be working . IF one job is not enough, WORK TWO …….I have been there done that , and dont feel sorry for anyone else ………didnt kill me, wont kill you . I recieved NO assistance, I expect YOU to recieve NO assistance. I am in no better condition IF NOT WORSE than many …….but yet my taxes are going to support welfare and food stamp programs ………FOR OTHER PEOPLE when ……..I am barely surviving MYSELF . I don’t WANT welfare assistance …….I am not jealous or whatever …..BUT I DO WISH , they would STOP taking away what little I DO HAVE TO SUPPORT MY OWN SELF …..to pay for programs for other lazy leeches and their lifestyles ……..IF I didnt pay my own way …….I would be homeless and hungry too ….BE RESPONSIBLE and take care of your damn self !!!!!!!

      • chris968

        I am truly disabled sorry to burst your bubble asshole.

      • Argument Clinic

        If we are running a surplus then we should “spread the surplus around”. The problem is we’re $20 trillion in debt!!

      • Kaat1220

        You forget your history. We are ALL here illegally.

        Our ancestors came to this country, and our men raped, murdered, and pillaged their way through the native american community.

        And again, you did not really read the entire article did you Brenda? You use services every single day from the government.

        And if you don’t like illegals, pack your bags, go back to England.

    • Argument Clinic

      How can we pay people to sit on their butts with federal tax dollars when we have 20 trillion dollars in debt? You’re playing the race card where there is no race issue. It’s purely economics. We can’t afford to pay for anyone to sit on their butt and do nothing. We’re broke! That’s a fact: http://www.usdebtclock.org/

      • SandyTodd

        But we can pay for Trump’s Wall, a massive expansion to a military that is already beyond anything necessary, trillion dollar infrastructure, undoing the ACA which is going to ADD to our deficit, on and on. But we can’t take care of people who ARE working? The second you said pay people to sit on their butts you repeated Reagan’s 80s “welfare queen” racebaiting bullshit.

      • Argument Clinic

        I know what’ll solve all of our problems: MORE BITCHING AND FINGER POINTING! It’s had a great track record so far!

      • SandyTodd

        They aren’t sitting on their butts. They’re working for Trump’s Billionaire Cabinet. Carl’s Jr, Hardees, Amway, Sago Mine, OneWest. They have all the money that should have been paid in taxes, through a higher capital gains tax, higher taxes on higher wages, and less money for federal programs.

      • Argument Clinic

        The billionaires you’re looking for are members of the US Chamber of Commerce and a lot of them are foreign nationals. The US Chamber of Commerce’s directory is right out in the open. You can find it in about 10 seconds doing a Google search. It would require you to actually accept facts though which I’m not sure you are capable of doing. That’s what they want us to do is point fingers at each other while they hoard all the money.

  • chris968

    I have been on food stamps for probably close to 7 years. Even while working a full time job with benefits, my yearly salary was only $16,400 (for being a teacher assistant in a special needs school!!! – I did WAY more work than i was getting paid for). I was nowhere near pulling even with my paychecks and my bills so I applied for food stamps and was immediately approved, and it made a huge difference. So no, I was not being lazy. But then I fell quite ill and am not disabled, so I have continued to receive food stamps on top of disability. If I didn’t have these programs to help me, I would be homeless and hungry. Which seems to be what conservatives want of the poor.

    • CharInOhio

      IF you were “sick enough” you would be deemed disabled ……sorry , but its just truth ………IF you are NOT deemed “disabled” you are expected to WORK like the rest of us ……IF one job is NOT ENOUGH , you get TWO jobs …..I had jobs WAY more physical that a teachers aide and was medically restricted against BOTH of them , but had to work two jobs ……..I didnt “like” it either ….but I did it and I didnt die ……..you wont either ……..I got ZERO food stamps or anything else and STILL dont ……my income is slightly over that $16,000 amount and have worked all my life . I dont EXPECT freebies or handouts , but it DOES really piss me off when … I get taxed to hell and back to pay for OTHER PEOPLE …….who feel …..I should pay and carry THEIR load too …….

      • chris968

        I am sick enough aka DISABLED which is why I am on DISABILITY asshole go bother somebody else.

      • That was really low. They did not tell you what disability they had. It could be completely different and more debilitating than yours. Shame on your assumptions! For the record, I work two management jobs. I work 70 hours a week. I barely sleep. I never buy things I want and can barely get the things I need, and I am on food stamps, so don’t give me your narrow minded, childish view on “trying harder.” Get an education. You’re post is almost unintelligible.

      • brad

        I agree with this dude. only 10% of the population is disabled
        25% of adults are poor in this country of america.
        laziness, dropping out of high school, have sex thus breeding kids into the world before getting married creates more poverty. when two poor broke ass adults have sex have kids sex causes females to have kids. it is not the governments job to raise your out of wedlock kids.
        having children out of wedlock creates poverty it make kids grow up being poor when the government gives single parents moms or dads a well fair check. all of you well fair brats are stealing money from working people. working people pay the taxes to support your sorry ass on that government check.

        if you need/want money get a full time job take care of your own dame kids. the government should not be raising kids plus taking care of grown ass adults.

        if the government wants to Create full time jobs fine.

        most poor people in america are
        single parents with 3 or more kids.
        lazy asses
        dope heads, drunks,
        high school drop outs that do not want a GED.
        adults with a criminal record.
        disabled people.

        fuck poor people.

        I am a republican time to cut all well fair programs
        time to lower taxes on all workers.

        businesses and corporations are owned by middle class, wealthy, and rich american’s this is fine.

        capitalism in gives good people that live by GOD’s rules an economic money advantage over those that do not.

        living a sin filled life style will cost you lots of money also living a sin filled life will get you fired from work.

        poverty and being poor is the result of sin and corruption 90% of the time. only 10% of adults are disabled.

        most middle class wealthy and rich people are those that graduated high school that work full time some of them graduated college. owning a business and or a corporation is a good thing because it proofs that working full time pays off.
        lets reduce all taxes and regulations on the private sector.

        only middle class, wealthy, rich people own/manage work in the private sector.
        working poor people are those just starting off they is young adults living with mom and dad they will be fine.

        every one in this nation that has a good life has worked hard and planned well to get the life they had.

        90% of those that have a miserable life in america are those that have been living in sin thus doing the wrong things

      • bobby smith

        Good fucking lord you don’t understand a thing. Kill yourself. You sinful racist clueless moron. You don’t even understand who takes the most of your time and money.

      • Jeremy Chase

        Against my better judgment, I saw this thread and I’m finding it very difficult not to chime in. I get what trolls are and what religious zeolots are and why they feel/do what they do. But under a genuine belief that poverty is sin Brad, I will pray for you to better understand your full-blooded American neighbors. The narrow lens that is discussed here, endemic of today’s GOP is so narrow that it CANNOT allow for any other life other than Brad’s. I would encourage you Brad (and all other readers) to pick up Robert Reich’s Beyond Outrage or watch this 2 minute video: youtu.be/Npj2U1PdIhI Brad, it sounds like you’ve read the bible too so you know that Jesus didn’t feed only a select few or only those not living in sin. But even beyond Jesus as an example, not everyone you meet had the same parenting as you, grew up in an abusive household (or didn’t), bad neighborhood, a bad school…etc. I’m all for working hard once you get your feet under you – I’m prior military with an honorable. But this cognitive dissonance; this hypocritical lashing out (and you’re NOT a troll, because that’s a different issue), really just comes from this image that those that are using welfare are somehow “less than?” I can tell you I’m not living in sin but I still struggle. I’m not abusing the welfare system but I still go hungry occasionly. It isn’t enough month to month, but I make it work. My point in chiming in (and really, it’s probably just falling on deaf ears on here), is to try to shift the paradigm away from this false image of welfare abusers. There really are far fewer of those kinds of people (ruining it for the rest of us) than the GOP or FOX “news” would like you to believe. Back in the day, FOX hired someone (Joe? I think his name was) to abuse food stamps on air as “proof” that welfare abuse was out of control. The segment that comes to mind is Joe buying seafood…? Anyway, the only sin there is on the part of a “news” organization painting all welfare recipients as “Joe.” Trying to put all of one kind of people – like yourself Brad and all other religious zeolots and the GOP – into one box, into one sterotype isn’t just cruel but it just isn’t the truth.

      • Kaat1220

        You really should not speak, EVER. You’re ignorant.

      • Donna Parsons

        if you truly only make 16,000 you are not paying being taxed the hell out of for food stamps and social programs. If you are single your taxes would only be about $500,a year and that supports the military, infrastructure, education, and much more only 6% of that goes for social programs or about $30.00,

      • Kaat1220

        That is simply not true. The majority of those who apply for disability do not get it the first time. Especially, if you don’t fit into one of their little boxes. So, you are talking about something you know nothing about.

        I think you just like to hear yourself talk . . .

      • Bubbles

        There’s the belief that the poor are presenting an awesome burden on everyone else, and then there’s reality: https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.desmoinesregister.com/amp/84917512

        Also, http://www.epi.org/publication/poor-people-work-a-majority-of-poor-people-who-can-work-do/

    • Jomama

      I feel for ya. Teachers do deserve better pay or at least equal pay. But that’s why it’s not the perfect system it should be.

      • chris968

        I remember seeing a political cartoon one time of two basketball players looking at a group of people in a limo, saying something like “Look at those teachers, I wish we could get paid like that to play basketball” and it made me realize just how backwards it is in this world that those who educate our youth get paid pennies compared to those who play a game.

      • Jomama

        Yup. There’s also those office jobs that pay shitloads more for them doing far less than teachers. Guess equal pay means nothing in the current job market. It’s probably going to stay that way for a long time.

  • miketothad

    Fitting and absolutely true.
    Tell your average “conservative” that their party, for decades, has been looking to hand their Medicare and their hard-earned Soc Sec over to Wall St. and they won’t have half a CLUE what you’re talking about.

    But, at the drop of a hat, they can tell you about all the affairs of their stereotypes of minorities… their greatest perceived threat.

  • Kenneth Henderson

    The Republicans agenda is evident, if you are poor, you don’t matter. If you are white and poor, you matter a little but just enough for you to hate those who are poor and are different than you. (I wonder how the GOP wrangles with the fact that the majority of those especially in the red states are white, poor, and on food stamps. Well like they say those who are uneducated, underpaid, and extremely patriotic are easier to control.)

    • Roger

      I think all homeless, the poor are lazy bastards and need to be euthanized or executed.

      • bobby smith

        You’re such a Christian. Why do white shitheads like you exist. You guys have RUINED this country with your backwater stupidity.

      • Roger

        We’re coming after all of you commie, liberals when we collapse the federal government! Be forewarned!

      • Kaat1220

        You should execute yourself. With your personality, I doubt ONE person will miss you.

      • Roger

        You better get your ass packing out of the country what you better do and regarding Christianity we need the Templars back to slaughter all the Liberals and Muslims!

      • Argument Clinic

        Not that I condone what Roger said but absolutely nothing in what he said had any Christian sentiment whatsoever. You’re just as stupid as he is and it is evident in your asinine response. The more people like you two continue this insane dialog the more this country will indeed go in the shitter.

      • Kaat1220

        You are a walking advertisement for why your parents should not have used the rhythm method.

    • Argument Clinic

      I hate both liberals and conservatives. Neither are really the problem. It’s the US Chamber of Commerce. Everyone is pissed about low economic opportunity for the past 10 years and pointing fingers at each other except the people that really did the damage. Liberals want everyone else to pay them because they think they were robbed of some opportunity and the think the conservatives did it, even though they didn’t. The people you’re looking for are the ones who pushed free trade agreements. Economists from every political spectrum agree that while we were promised lower good prices and more better jobs, we got lower good prices but less, worse jobs. They are neither liberal or conservative. They represent the wealthy elite which only care about one thing: MONEY. Might as well call them the MONEY party. That’s who you ought to really be pissed at but you know keep on fighting amongst yourselves. That’s what they want you to do so you don’t come after them and they can live the good life while you live like peasants fighting in pig stys.

  • Pdrevlut1

    Racism? While there is a racial component, the reason R’s dislike welfare is economic. In a nutshell, welfare adds leverage in negotiating pay/benefits for those at the bottom of the economic ladder. When employers are wanting to pay close to what could be easily drawn from public assistance, the incentive to work is not there. When you smash welfare programs employers can fuck over workers at will.

    • JTW

      That doesn’t explain why poor Republicans oppse welfare.

  • Melly50

    It is incredible that they still get away with this charade decade after decade. Perpetuating this ignorance about why poverty exists in the first place and as a diversion they pit poor against poor, white against black, middle class against anyone not middle class. There is not and never was any truth to Reagans lie about the ‘welfare queen’ he told us about. The real culprit is the welfare Queens who are very white and very rich 1% who suck out billions of revenue from this country with every tax and corporate loophole Republicans create for them. The amounts they steal from this country each year do not compare to the amounts we pay in social services. These fat greedy cows have incredible nerve to point their fingers at any welfare or food stamp recipient
    I have seen how people struggle, black and white just to survive on welfare and it certainly isn’t people choosing to raise a child or children on amounts of money so meager that I would call insane and impossible. Those who sit in judgement are the people who couldn’t do what these people do. They would crumble.
    Wake up America and notice the hypocrisy. They refuse n fight to require any sort of fair or livable wage from those making off the chart profits and when that leaves people no choice but to need food stamps or help even when working full time jobs if they can one and they blame them for choosing to feed and house their families. Rather than help citizens they reward these profiteering corporations who took the livable wage jobs overseas and choose to pay American workers wages so low people are forced to need some help. What is stopping so many people from seeing what they are pulling? I would just like one Republican to not blame but actually tell us what they expect people to do?

  • Buck Houston

    You don’t have to read far to read that you acknowledge the redistributive nature of these benefits, but you never consider that they’re obvious to the educated.

    You dismiss it expressly – despite frankly an overabundance of conservative writings all over the place saying indeed that’s the problem.

    Business travelers to Asia or W. Europe know that American liberalism or “democrat” has become the moniker, or the “politically correct” term, that the worlds’ educated and “accomplished” use to refer to the “american ignorant”. It’s now much wider than in america alone.

    If you people want to regain any form of credibility or respect. I suggest you think before you display the boogeymen that haunt those hyena-like minds of yours.

    • JTW

      You have obviously never traveled outside of your bubble. Western Europeans know that the ignorant flock to the Republican party.

      • Buck Houston

        Decades ago, precisely where the footnote of “democrat” belongs.

      • JTW

        I have news for you. The Republican party is the one that must change or it will die. Many Republicans realize this. Republicans have become such extremists (on abortion, on evolution, on climate change, on contraception, on destroying the social safety net, etc.) that they will not see the inside of the White House unless the Democratic president invites them over for coffee.

  • Jomama

    I whole heartedly agree. This is why most non republican citizens think republicans are selfish & arrogant & should have no place in politics. I’m a Democrat myself but not all republicans think this way. Some who are good enough to be mayors, governors & presidents understand the democratic perspective. Which is why things like socail security benefits & other well fair services have survived this long. If all republicans truly hated welfare & socal services things like socail security & other government funded programs & they had their way all the time those would be gone by now. Republicans & Democrats are supposed to work together to solve problems. It’s true some republicans shouldn’t be in politics but hey, that’s politics for ya.

  • John StackDecker

    That’s right. Indigent food programs are really Big Government imposed slavery! Call a spade a spade and dance a jig.

  • Kaat1220

    I am sick of those who swear that you don’t take a dime from anyone. You clearly skimmed this article, or you lack reading comprehension.

    You get government assistance in one way or another without knowing it. Yet, instead of admitting it, you start with your long-winded propaganda. No one wants to hear it. So, I guess because unmarried adults keep having kids, those kids don’t need to eat? The kids should be punished because you think the parents are milking the system? You would prefer to have a bunch of poor, starving people (a lot of them, kids) in the streets?

    What ruins your entire argument is that you have now voted in a President who goes against your entire philosophy. You now have an entire freeloading family. Yet, you still show support for a white President who goes on vacation every weekend in Florida, and now, his entire family is in Aspen to the tune of $12 million dollars for security alone. When Eric Trump went to Uruguay, his hotel bill alone was almost $100,000. And not a peep from you, because he is white, you will gladly pay your hard-earned tax dollars.

    When one points this out to Trump followers, the first thing you do is point out that Obama took vacations. Well, he did. All presidents do. However, Obama’s vacations were quite reasonable.

    Trump has been in office TWO months, and he and his family are hemorrhaging money.

    Sorry to say, your problem is that you are racists, and you do not maintain a consistent philosophy.

    You voted into office a freeloader, someone who has cheated at every single thing he has done in life; you voted in a used car salesman, and ended up with a lemon.