The Next Time a Gun Nut Says We Need More Guns to Make Us Safer, Just Show Them This

michael-bloomberg-wants-to-ban-guns-in-chipotleWhen it comes to guns and gun violence in America, it’s astonishing how for millions common sense goes right out the window.  Pretty much any credible stat showing global gun violence shows that not only does the United States lead the industrialized world in gun violence (per 100,000 people), but it’s not even close.

Countries similar to us like Canada, Australia and England, which have much stricter regulations on firearms, have a fraction of the gun violence.

Yet despite this indisputable evidence, these gun nuts still honestly believe that even though we have well over 300 million guns in this country – we need more guns.

Often they’ll tout Chicago, and its gun violence, as the “example” of what happens when “liberals pass their strict regulations on guns.”  This, of course, is a ridiculous comparison because one city doesn’t prove anything. The best way to look at gun violence is to take each state and compare the gun violence (per 100,000 people) to really paint a picture as to where gun violence is really a problem.

So, let’s do just that.  Here are the top 10 states with the most gun homicides per 100,000 people:

  1. Louisiana (18.8)
  2. Mississippi (17.9)
  3. Alaska (16.9)
  4. Wyoming (16.7)
  5. Oklahoma (16.6)
  6. Montana (16.3)
  7. Arkansas (16.0)
  8. Alabama (16.0)
  9. New Mexico (14.8)
  10. South Carolina (14.8)

Notice something?  8 out of 10 of those states has a Republican governor (the exceptions being Montana and Arkansas), and all except for New Mexico have a Republican controlled state legislature / general assembly.  Not only that, but since 2000, every state but New Mexico (2008, 2012) voted for the Republican candidate for president.

Needless to say, these aren’t exactly “liberal anti-gun” states.

For the record, the national average for gun homicides per 100,000 is 10.38.  So these states aren’t only above average, they’re well above average.

And just for the “fun” of it, let’s look at the 10 poorest states in the United States:

  1. Mississippi
  2. Arkansas
  3. West Virginia
  4. Alabama
  5. Kentucky
  6. New Mexico
  7. Tennessee
  8. Louisiana
  9. South Carolina
  10. Oklahoma

Fascinating, isn’t it?  Seven of the ten states that lead the United States in gun homicides also lead it in poverty. For another intriguing look at the big picture, check out CNBC’s rankings for the 10 worst states to live in – you’ll see many of these same states listed on there as well.

It would seem the best way to reduce gun violence would be to fight poverty – not buy more guns.  Because as these stats show, very pro-gun states lead the country in gun violence.

And isn’t it interesting how so many “strongly Republican states” are some of the poorest in the country, while Republicans are also the same party that feverishly pushes gun ownership?

It’s a brilliantly dangerous con.  You support economic policies that keep people poor, undoubtedly resulting in more violence.  That violence then helps create the right environment for people to believe fear mongering gun propaganda, which spikes gun and ammo sales (which is great for the NRA that just happens to heavily back the GOP).  Toss in a little religion to control people socially, pander to racism, and that’s basically the foundation of the Republican party.

Because if guns were the answer, every pro-gun Republican controlled state in the United States would be the safest ones in which to live.  But that’s clearly not the case.

Then again, you’d have to be an absolute fool to think that more guns solves gun violence anyway.  And that’s what gun nuts are – fools.

Allen Clifton

Allen Clifton is a native Texan who now lives in the Austin area. He has a degree in Political Science from Sam Houston State University. Allen is a co-founder of Forward Progressives and creator of the popular Right Off A Cliff column and Facebook page. Be sure to follow Allen on Twitter and Facebook, and subscribe to his channel on YouTube as well.


Facebook comments

  • poverty kills people not guns

    • nate

      What a stupid comment.

      • ts

        I got to agree. I am not pro gun but have no idea what that means

      • Stephen Barlow

        All THREE of you goobers get yur lernin’ in Texas?

        This is about the parallel between poverty, and violent gun crimes that are more prevalent in Republican governed States. Which also happen to have BOTH more poverty and less education thatn the other 80% of the nation.

        They also have the bottom 20% of healthcare opportunities, twice as many churches per capita and more teen age pregnancies.

      • thank you for enlightening the mASSES

      • Charles Vincent

        poverty and violent crime as a whole.

      • YoungMD

        Leave Texas out of it. It’s not on the list.

      • Stephen Barlow

        Of megagunut states?

      • Carlos Sierz

        And all those statistics have no other common denominators except for “lack of education”.

        You might break it down just a little bit further than that. Of course, if you do that, you’ll find out that you have a small perspective and little knowledge of the world outside your own little corner.

      • read the article and you might not find it so stupid if you pay attention instead of running your mouth

      • David Bartelt

        you’re an idiot

      • I see you have just accomplished a Mecca David Barteit….you spelled idiot correctly, now you can say your life has had purpose

      • Taylor Long

        Steve i agree with you and cravin lol you guys made this post worth reading

      • cravin moorehead

        @Steve it trying to explain to you that the intelligence level of the people that live in those pro gun states, isn’t all that high.

        They place a greater importance on gun ownership than they do on education.

        Got it?

        Now, who’s stupid?

      • Stephen Barlow

        YOU .

      • cravin moorehead


        It took you a month to come up with that response.

        And, you STILL don’t get it!

      • Stephen Barlow

        Did it EVER occur to you that I A) HAVE A LIFE and
        B) don’t give a prison rape what about you at ALL!?????

      • cravin moorehead

        You are an illiterate.

        Please ask your “sixth grade”, daughter, to proof read your posts.

        I will no longer respond to your posts, as you are a dolt.

      • Stephen Barlow

        BEt I can prove you a liar.

      • Stephen Barlow

        Sorry that is TOO simple for such and erudite monstermind such as yourself.

        In your family was sperm donor the aomeba and or the paramecium.

        Let’s see if he gets this one right… LMAO.

      • diamondmask

        AMOEBA not aomeba


        Your second line makes no sense at all.

        Stop drinking before you post.

      • Stephen Barlow

        I MEANT aomeba, so I typed aomeba. But since you don’t recognize critical thinking where you were molested as an infant… you assumed it was a typo.

      • diamondmask

        Ah, so you misspell words
        on purpose to show your critical thinking skill. That’s not a technique I’ve
        considered. Interesting. Stupid, but

      • Stephen Barlow

        YOu can’t even quoteArte Johnson correctly Schultzie.

      • Carlos Sierz

        Only guns can kill people retard. If you leave a gun alone in a room, it actually grows legs and a trigger finger and heads to the local mall or nearest school.

        You can’t blame or impose consequences upon individuals. They’re not the ones responsible. Didn’t your parents teach you that evil doesn’t exist?

        I’m with Nate.


    • Ton_Chrysoprase

      Poverty of the mind leads people to want to own guns (for purposes other than hunting or small calibre sports shooting). The combination of poverty of the mind and guns kills people. FTFY

      • pl

        It really does not matter what province, state, country.
        If we are fighting here already (with words), how can we expect peace?
        Please be more confident and polite to each other.
        Fact is, we don’t need any guns and poverty must improve, no matter where on this planet.

      • chris

        We do need guns. The purpose of them is to prevent the tyranny of the Government! A people without the means to defend themselves is ripe for imprisonment or worse for any reason those twits in Washington want to fashion out of the wind whether they be democrat or republican.

      • Tori Browning

        Do you seriously believe you could defend yourself against the U.S. Military, the National Guard. or even the local police with your peashooters? Perhaps that may have been a possibility when the Constitution was written, but it certainly hasn’t been the case since WWI.

        Who are you kidding?

      • Carlos Sierz

        Aw Tori,

        We’ll since I happen to be in both the Army National Guard (8 yrs) and work as a Deputy Sheriff in a sizeable department (4 yrs) I can attest that, Yes, a sizeable organized militant force could stand up and very easily take down both a police department and the National Guard with standard AR-15 rifles, .308 or better Sniper Rifles and home-made explosives.

        Not to mention, most of the military and police force personnel are conservatives and vote Republican, you’d see a large defect rate if government tyranny was the issue.

        Never underestimate the effectiveness of a well-coordinated strategic attack. Especially if large numbers of people are behind it.

    • Stephen Polasky

      Steve’s trying (and failing) to go all Yoda on us folks. Help him we will.

      • Guest

        In the end let’s see who’s still alive birdbrain because you have the intellectual capacity of a great and when you make a look-alike an ass all you can do is come up with stupid jokes you’re really going to go far in life Sonnyboy

      • Guest

        In the end let’s see who’s still alive birdbrain because you have the intellectual capacity of a grape and when all you can do is come up with stupid jokes? you’re really going to go far in life Sonnyboy

    • Rose Bounds

      I understand you perfectly Steve and I agree with you. Just because some of ya’ll don’t understand this comment, doesn’t make it stupid; it might however be some of that “poverty of the mind” to which he is referring. Poverty at its core is a state of want, desperation, lacking, and starvation. Poverty of the mind includes all of those things. We starve for education and passion and peace and harmony in our lives. Living in a violent and desperate society creates mental poverty, a constant state of being which is starved for a proper education, strong character, and the ability to pursue passion. Our Founders and their children handled guns quite safely. They neither shot themselves, their baby sisters, nor committed random murder. Why? Because they were educated; well fed on logic, compassion, understanding, study, and the passions of intelligent people. Poverty of the mind IS what causes violence. Desperate angry people kill each other for reasons logic rarely reveals to be reasonable. The sad thing is, I think the people who can’t understand what Steve said there, may be just the kind of people to which he was referring.

      • Stephen Barlow

        I think it’s much more simple than that.

        A poor mind (one with limited ethical and moral resources)
        decides to kill from instinctive/reflexive defense of a misperceived threat.

        But with a gun handy, they don’t have enough time to THINK LONG ENOUGH about the consequences. They just BLAM BLAM and the results are obvious. Look @ FergMO.

        Even a trained, decorated COP couldn’t resist the allure of emptying his clip in an unarmed man running from gunshots, who STOPPED, surrendered and DIED.

        He should have kept running.

        You know Wilson’s pro killer friends have raised $70,000 for his defense.

        I wonder how much has been raised for Micheal Brown’s burial and family.

      • Carlos Sierz

        Nice try remaking the story. He shot the guy because the guy had seriously assaulted him, hurt him badly and was again running at him. It was justified at every level of government.

    • thomasbone63

      You don’t give people in poverty guns.

    • Christopher Willis

      makes perfectly good sense Steve, im sure the other replies don’t understand what you mean exactly, those people in poverty don’t have to be violent, if they were grateful for the things they had wouldn’t worry about what they don’t have, when you worry about that your mind is in poverty bc you probably have everything you need, you just WANTED more.

    • Dave Cleveland

      So let’s just say that guns, bombs and knives don’t kill people; terrorist do. So, obviously to fix that, let’s give everyone more guns, bombs and knives and the problem will go away.

      • Carlos Sierz

        Good job! You figured it out! That’s called, “The balance of power”.

    • God the Holy Father

      People with poverty of the mind and an Armalite AR-15 kill people much quicker and more easily than just people with poverty of the mind.

      • Carlos Sierz

        A maniac with a Glock 22 could do more lethal damage than someone with an AR15 anywhere between 5 and 30 yards, which happens to be about the average for urban combat.

        The entire argument against AR15s is ridiculous. The liberal government doesn’t want citizens owning because they’re mid-range tactical Rifles with great accuracy and they happen to be a similar model to what our military personnel use.

        It’s not about deadlines to society, it’s about leftist government officials fearing an uprising.

    • Vladimir5j2

      Poverty of the mind with a gun.

  • Avatar

    I simply realize that the gun nuts doesn’t understood the morale of the power itself, they desire to use the gun to feel powerful without moral and most important, common-fucking-sense.

    Gun nuts are absolute selfish and narcissistic people. The nihilistic punch line of this article is that ammosexuals are fucking stupid people in this country. I rather to throw them out of America and invite in well educated immigrant children and their families.

    • Carlos Sierz

      So, you take out all the people who own guns and stockpile ammunition.

      How do you suppress violent attacks?

  • Brian

    Arms manufacturers make a mint off tragedy. Every time a shooting happens, every time someone gets shot and its publicized, ammo sales skyrocket. Gun manufacturers love dead children.

    • Hunter Rose

      As crazy as that sounds, it’s true in a convoluted sort of way. It’s not that they ‘love dead children’, it’s that they love how people respond to mass shootings by calling for gun restrictions. In turn, paranoid gun nutz stock up.

      • Carlos Sierz

        Define “paranoid gun nuts”. I think you might be using “paranoid” improperly

  • Jay Zatzkin

    If the NRA did not threaten to back their opponents or trash their reputations maybe some Congress and women would stand up to the NRA BS and the people’s safety would actually come first!!

    • Stephen Barlow

      The SADDEST thing is the FEAR is enough! The NRA LOST almost all the races they invested heavily in the last 2 elections…

  • TexasDamnYankee

    What the article did not state was just how many violent crimes are committed by people who LEGALLY own guns. My guess is that it’s significantly lower than those who ILLEGALLY own guns.

    • TexasDamnYank

      By the way, I was born and raised in Chicago, not going back.

      • Stephen Barlow

        YOu think Chicago is an HONEST bellweather for Gun Rights?

    • Stephen Barlow

      True, but isn’t that EXACTLY THE POINT? That poor, prejudiced, religiously stratified people can more easily buy guns in RED states, where they are less likely to get an education, a good job or an abortion to keep from being even poorer and raising an EXTRA unwanted child of poverty.

    • TheStupidItBurns

      I think you might be surprised at how many guns are legal through loopholes. There are almost no requirements for re-selling guns after you buy them. This is where the problem lies.

    • Mo Reno

      FBI crime stats report that 76% of guns used in crime are legally-obtained weapons.

      • Charles Vincent

        That’s a complete exaggeration of the facts.
        http://extranosalley DOT com/?p=36406
        Saying that is intellectually dishonest.

      • Stephen Barlow

        Coming from you… it’s ONLY legal garble bargle, to quote Scalia in an opinion.

      • I believe that is the low end of the percentage and the FBI didn’t want to offend the NRA by making that higher.

      • Stephen Barlow

        BEcause there ARE almost NO restrictions or controls on gubn purchases in RED states. Look at WHERE those guns are SOLD. You will see how much more Urban Crime is BECAUSe of RED STATE gun proliferation and profiteering.

  • RLGanley

    What is the stats on the lowest gun homicides and it’s relationship to wealth and education? Am curious

    • Stephen Barlow

      That would be interesting. Along with the Gun Control Laws in place in those states.

    • Karen

      Please realize that the figures I have used are homicides, not gun deaths. In my opinion, you cannot consider suicide a violent crime, nor a murder by firearm. This article took the total of deaths (including suicide, and I would assume shooting by police officer) into consideration for their lists and article. Unfair and misleading data imho.

      • Stephen Barlow

        Well, let’s lock youi na room and have you watch your mother put a gun in her vagina and blow her rape child away because your RIGHT RED AGENDA closed the clinics that would have helped keep from raising another YOU>

        Then you tell me that Half the gun deaths are NON VIOLENT!

  • Romeo Horsecock

    The term ‘gun nuts’ needs to stop being used. It’s language already set up to place negative connotations on people immediately, much like the term ‘conspiracy theorist’. You don’t have to agree with those who have the opposite view that you do on the gun control issue, but many who do are not ‘nuts’ and it’s infantile and asinine to call them so.

    • Stephen Barlow

      So you SUPPORT carrying loaded assault rifles while shopping for toys and diapers in Target?

      YOu don’t think that is “nuts”?

      YOu believe that arming teachers will prevent school shootings? That “GUNS EVERYWHERE” legislation is NOT “nuts”. The only people who need to protect themselves in CHURCH with a gun are OTHER JACKOFFS WITH A GUN!!!!

      • Romeo Horsecock

        First of all you are exactly the type of person I am talking about. You make assumptions and then insults when that is not necessary and more importantly not helpful to the conversation at hand. If anything it makes the dialogue go backwards, not forward.

        Second of all, no I do not support open carry. It makes others feel uncomfortable and it doesn’t serve much of a purpose. Just because you can do something, doesn’t always mean you should.

        No, I do not consider all of those who do decide to open carry “nuts”, I view them as American citizens who are wanting to exercise their rights under the Second Amendment of the U.S. Constitution.

        Although I am against the practice of openly carrying a firearm in public I can still disagree with another persons ideology without insulting and belittling them, it’s really not that difficult, it’s called being an adult.

        And as for the rest of your rant it’s simple “appeal to emotion” tactics. You attempted to manipulate an emotional response in place of a valid or compelling argument, therefore so since you didn’t give a valid or compelling argument, there is nothing for me to “strain” my critical thinking skills on.

      • Stephen Barlow

        I was responding to “infantile and assinine” from a guy who advocates that we DON’T call a SPADE a SPADE. WHO objects to stereotyping and insulting descriptions.

        Sorry you can’t man up and actually play your own word game.

        I asked you to replace GUNS with INCEST in every sentence you use. ‘Turnip’ would make the same point, but turnips are harmless, whereas the gun nuts you defend are NOT!

      • Romeo Horsecock

        “WHO objects to stereotyping and insulting descriptions.” Oh, we can’t have that! LMAO You need to lean how to communicate like an adult, if you except to be taken seriously.

      • Stephen Barlow

        Uhm… ANSWER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

      • Stephen Barlow

        Me Gun Nut… Talk Loud.

        Me Coward… Not Answer.

      • Karen

        The fact that you cannot have an “adult” conversation about the issue shows your lack of self control. I think we should call you the Nut Sack.

      • Stephen Barlow

        Act like an adult K. and I’ll converse with you. Kinda glad you are scoping out My junk. Lemme put a Speedo on for you.

        Can you squeeze them both into one cup so I don’t have to guess whether you are boy in drag? I know it’ll make you look lopsided, but the hump on your neck will get ‘balanced’ out ‘fairly’ that way.

      • Keen Edge


      • Stephen Barlow

        I am amazed you can even spell that. Don’t you just love you Mommy who can use spellcheck for you?

      • Keen Edge

        you mommy?

      • Stephen Barlow


      • Bethany Alexandra

        You make us who are against open carry look bad. Calm down and quit insulting people you damn child.

      • Stephen Barlow

        Love that stripper’s name doll!

      • Bethany Alexandra

        Thanks, I’ll let my mom know!! Also, thanks for proving my point! I love being right, you know, when I’m not busy on the pole.

    • adcbeast

      Guns have no place in the civilian world … too many drunk, drugged, mental patients

    • Cemetery Girl

      Actually, gun nut isn’t really off base. Nut can mean enthusiast or mean foolish, eccentric, or crazy. I used to refer to my husband as a gun nut. He owns several, has a concealed carry permit, and enjoys gun smithing as a hobby. He is an enthusiast, but people that treat guns irresponsibly or give gun owners a bad image annoy him. While gun nut absolutely has a negative image, it is an image that is being earned by some gun owners. Foolish is probably a kind way to describe the insistance to open carry rifles in mundane public settings. It makes people uncomfortable (because most people will be uncomfortable in a restaurant or store when some stranger is roaming around with rifles), and their response to this discomfort is essentially “it is my God given right to carry guns and there’s nothing you can do about it!” There’s no consideration for the public or for the businesses. Many responsible gun owners have no desire to be lumped with those people. Their actions are creating the negative connantation and at this rate the term “gun owner” will be just as negative.

    • GUN NUT = gun owner with O.C.D. and most everybody has some level of OCD obsessive compulsive disorder …you can tell by the way they respond 🙂

  • Kolten Frazier

    Put a gun in every home and we would be the safest country out there. Nobody is going to rush into a building when they know there’s a gun in there with someone who can use it.

    • Stephen Barlow

      NO body rushes into building ANYWAY!!!! That is NRA Fantasy!!!! MOST guns in the home KILL THE RESIDENTS.

    • Cemetery Girl

      Horrible idea. Some people should not have a gun. People with some forms of poorly controlled mental instability just should not have a gun. The average citizen has the right to have a gun but it doesn’t mean that they’re better off having one. Too many people aren’t vilagent about gun safety. They keep guns loaded and “hidden” someplace easy to find (because they want it easy to get when the burglar breaks into their house while they’re sleeping.) Reality, the burglar is probably going to break in when no one is home. So he/she can steal the gun and if the owner walks in during the crime risks having their own gun used on them. Of course this ignores that if every household were to have a gun then every criminal could also just grab the household gun before going to commit a crime…

  • William Neal

    And lets us not forget to add that the majority of the gun violence that is happening in New Orleans, which has always had a Democratic mayor, is “black on black” murders and violent crimes. The crimes in the black communities are what make the crime rate in New orleans so high. No, you won’t ever get a news media to say the world black murderer or black victims, or the mayor to point out the most violent crimes are in predominately all black communities and neighborhoods. Nor will you hear that the muggings, robberies, burglaries in New Orleans are being committed against white tourists and residents and are being committed by black minors out after curfew in New Orleans. I live here. I’ll fill you in on the real facts of crime and gun violence in New Orleans and it does not come from Republican citizens or governors, or legal gun owners.

    • Stephen Barlow

      HOw many white on white murders are defended by Public Defenders or Legal Aid Lawyers? THAT will tell you whole story in a nutshell.

      How is the BLACK unemployment rate in NOLA.

      Ever date a black girl? Or boy? Did I just make you cringe and flame over with anger?

      Did those questions make you wanna fondle your gun or shoot Me?

      • William Neal

        not at all. the numbers would be minute compared to black on black crime and black crime on white tourists and residents.
        I would assume the black unemployment rate is in the double digits considering the amount of blacks receiving SNAP Food Stamps, energy subsidies, section 8 or free housing and medicaid, and doing nothing else but birthing babies and getting more benefits. And not one child support payment from a black sperm donor.
        Sorry I don’t find black girls or boys attractive, or the way they smell.
        No anger here. Don’t worry, be happy.

      • Stephen Barlow

        An unrepentant racist. Kinda nice to see one out in the open these days. Most of your kind try to pass for human.

      • William Neal

        Actually I am a white racist and in a surprising minority these days.
        There are far more black racists in America, who try to pass for victims and humans.

      • Stephen Barlow

        One of you is too many.

    • adcbeast

      William DOOOSH … Yes … Let’s use white governance on the state level to keep black people poor then blame poor people for the crimes they commit to survive ..

      You are a disingenuous sack of S …

      • William Neal

        All of that blame about the white man keeping the black man down, was supposed to end, as so many blacks were quoted as saying after obama’s first election, “… that we got a black president, I won’t have to pay for my mortgage or electric bill or work no more. All of us blacks will be taken care of……”

        The black people and communities get more help and protections than any other race period. The will not accept responsibility for their own failures and their continued example of how to get all you can get free, passed on to their children and grandchildren.

        The exact reason legal gun owners are fighting for their rights is in defense of these animals with no moral compass or respect for themselves or for life.

      • adcbeast

        William DOOOSH … You need a mental health evaluation …

      • William Neal

        been there…done that…

      • adcbeast

        Clearly you have mental issues and should be a in a rubber room

      • William Neal

        been there…done that also….now I am out on ROR with a sheesh load of meds trying to keep me mentally stable and balanced……but I got them fooled… hahaha lol

      • Stephen Barlow

        Whitey invested TAX MONEY on Affirmative Action, Special scholarships, schools, housing and jobs programs… they designed WELFARE as a STEP UP WITH A HELPING HAND and the Black community for the most part took the steps.

        THAT AIN’T ‘Whitey keeping Blackie down.”

        Most ofthe bangers WANT TO BE bangers. They don’t WANT the American Dream, they want the Ice Cube and Icee T and Tupac and Biggie Fat Rapper dream.

        Let them have it.

        But DON’T blame ME for their choices.

        ANY crack dealer on any corner could end his career in the BLACK, take his earnings to a bus station and BUILD A NEW LIFE anywhere in this great country (except your backyard) ANY day of any week.

        Dope slingers are not caged and they can take their cash and dash.

      • William Neal

        That’s exactly what I was saying…..all that holding the black man down crap…was supposed to be over with the election of the first black president.. He was supposed to be the example to all blacks that if they try hard enough and take advantage of all the free government programs, like affirmative action, free tuition and housing, the American Negro College Fund, and special advantage racial programs, they also could climb out of welfare, food stamps, medicaid and defeat these dependent programs.

      • Stephen Barlow

        Racism like YOUR’s will never die, you’ll just get some trailer trash pregnant and she’ll pass the birth defect down the line.

      • William Neal

        ……..and we will wrap him in a swaddling blanket of the Confederate Flag.

      • Stephen Barlow

        The one full of holes with dysentery on it?

      • Stephen Barlow

        Bobbie Jindal is as white as Raj on Big Bang Theory.

      • adcbeast

        Stephen DOOOSH … Jindal sure tries to act white … you know … since many republicans might confuse his dark skin with a terrorist

      • Stephen Barlow

        Kinda what I said DOUCHEwater.

      • adcbeast

        Raj doesn’t try to act white .. he’s just a goober

      • Stephen Barlow

        Excellent point. but like Jinboi…
        he has NO CLUE WHO he really is.

      • Stephen Barlow

        Oh no, he is as white as rice paper. Just look at his agenda in LA and listen to his crap about how he’ll run America when he’s elected dic tater.

      • Stephen Barlow

        Obama tries to act like a Brother from the Hood, but he fails. Too much Harvard in the boy.

      • Stephen Barlow

        BLACK’s don’t have their OWN SPECIALIZED hiphop,ghetto,disco,pimpin’,chillin’, gang CULTURE? THAT’s crap still hanging from the anus!!!!

        Are most black people civilized and decent. hell yeah!!!

        But they CREATED their OWN apartheid. PROOF? Why can’t a white guy deliver pizza supplies to a deli in Haarlem? BLACK RACISM AND APARTHEID in America.

      • adcbeast

        Stephen DOOOSH .. Us white people created black society in America .. don’t like to me and don’t lie to yourself .. Blacks have the life we let them have

        NEXT !!!

    • Stephen Barlow

      Has nothing to do with politics and EVERYTHING to do with ignorance of the ACTUAL 2nd amendment in it’s entirety.

  • Stephen Barlow

    I think CLifton has it WRONG.

    “isn’t it interesting how so many “strongly Republican states” are some of the poorest in the country, while Republicans are also the same party that feverishly pushes gun ownership? It’s a brilliantly dangerous con. You support economic policies that keep people poor, undoubtedly resulting in more violence. That violence then helps create the right environment for people to believe fear mongering gun propaganda, which spikes gun and ammo sales (which is great for the NRA that just happens to heavily back the GOP). Toss in a little religion to control people socially, pander to racism, and that’s basically the foundation of the Republican party.”

    I think it works the other way around. FIRST, you ‘godsmack’ ’em. Bible beat the kids, guilt them from birth that sex is dirty, nasty, sick. Teach your children that birth control is murder… and you DENY them ANY sex education EXCEPT virginity. Just to make sure you breed enough of them, you deny as many women as possible, CONSTITUTIONAL MEDICAL CARE and REPRODUCTIVE RIGHTS. You even have SCOTUS ignore science, deny truth and fact, and let their parents employers DENY them birth control to protect THEIR EMPLOYERS personal religious First Amendment CORPORATE ‘rights’.

    THEN you unfund their education system. You set them up to fail through austerity infrastructure budgeting so schools can not refurbish existing structures and systems, while simultaneously adopting mandatory testing to an arbitrary score that would advance America’s standing compared to nations who invest more per capita on free schools colleges. And just for spite, call it “No Child Left Behind.” (Gotta love that republican humor) Top it off with a mandate to DENY ALL CHILDREN critical thinking skills.

    THAT is step one. Reaganomically speaking, you force TWO generations of ignorance into existence. Because sexually ignorant children taught limited options and given limited opportunities, begat MORE STUPID, sexually repressed children!!!

    So more teen pregnancies, less job opportunities (via Republican Fiscal ignorance and systematic deregulation mandating upward transfer of wealth) creates anger, frustration and violence @ home, and al the while the NRA (Arm’s Dealers Anonymous and Death Tool Manufacturer’s Association)comes in with it’s “Youth Sportsmanship Programs.

    Guns are cool, Gun are cool, Guns are cool.
    Movies and video games SELL this to kids from toddlerhood. (Coyote vs Roadrunner. MOST kids cartoons)

    Guns don’t kill people, Guns don’t kill people, Guns don’t kill people.
    When guns are outlawed only outlaws will have guns.
    Obama is coming to take AWAY your guns.
    Walmart expands it’s KILLING TOOL sales.

    Stand Your Ground, Stand Your Ground, Stand Your Ground.
    Sheriff’s refusing to enforce gun legislation nationwide.
    Congress denies what 80% of the NATION wants because of NRA threats to fund ANY candidate against career politicians.

    So you crowd more of these Hyper religious, students of more diverse backrounds into smaller schools with less educational materials, and the racism of Religion these kids were weaned on creates a pre adolescent attitude towards hate for other cultures because “there is only ONE way, one true God, ONE REAL religion!

    Then you make lying the norm in political advertising, funding hate ads, swiftboat propaganda blitzes, “grassroots’ Sedition movements and you breed a new generation adamant, extremist Republicans from the slow deterioration of the Constitution, public education, and forced religion.

    SO in a nutshell, kids who are forced to ‘go to Sunday School’ the morning after their Dad’s beat and rape their Mothers, 8 year olds take their BB guns out on after failing the mandated tests that poor black kids did better on because the black kids don’t get BB guns for Christmas…

    … And you start killing animals and torturing pets, just like your card carrying Konservative Khristian Konspiracy Daddy did.

    YOu don’t start with Reaganomic Excess, you start by deceiving and shaming kids about sex; teaching them lies, segregation and contempt for ANYONE who is not or does not believe EXACTLY like them; entertain them with violent games and censor shows to glorify violence and stigmatize sex…

    THEN you downsize them and send their jobs overseas, rape the treasury, foment a religious war for oil, swindle them out of their homes, steal their retirement savings so they have to work until they are DEAD and nominate a senile geezer with a pregnant, gun toting, spokeMILF blowup doll as the economy continues to crash and America’s strongest industry teeters on the verge of BANKRUPT COLLAPSE…

    And you have Fox News SELL the lie that “This is all THE BLACK GUY’s Fault!”

    He got the right story, but just in the wrong order.

    SEX should be taught from 2nd grade and Religion should ONLY be a Senior level High School class. Why? BEcause sex is a natural biological imperative that kids understand from age 8 and religion is a complex intangible concept that adults have NEVER understood for the whole of the 6000+ years of written history.

    • Frank McAlister

      and then you have anti gun nuts like yourself that spout figures and facts that don’t take all aspects into account. People that are law abiding and have registered there guns are not the problem. it is the criminals that don’t care about the law and would be unable to get a gun legally that is most of the problem. As had been said here before more people are killed by car crashes every year but i don’t see idiots like you saying “we must ban cars!!!” If you want to have an intelligent conversation with people stop being so obnoxious. I would be more scared of someone like you that tries to force there views on everybody!!!

      • Stephen Barlow

        I am not anti guns, I am all about understanding they require the utmost responsibility and that only criminals would need to avoid registering their armory.

      • darwin

        LOL glocks run about 550 bucks, not 1500

      • Stephen Barlow

        For the cheap ones. What’s the top of the line gangster toy running these days?

        Maybe I was thinking a Desert Eagle.

      • Frank McAlister

        for your info i enjoy target shooting and hunting. i did not buy my guns to defend myself. if it came down to it i would but that was not the purpose. i enjoy having them and using them. and as for officers that are being killed i think that is repugnant and an example of a criminal using a gun that was illegaly purchased or stolen. as far as illegal guns did you ever stop to think about all the guns coming over the borders from canada and mexico. the same as the drugs coming over the borders and the illegal immigrants. yep we have stopped all them and solved the problems. it is impossible. yes some guns are stolen from homes but if you check into where the majority of illegal guns are coming from it is from other countrys. we have had numerous shootings here and it was found out that the guns are being bought into our country from caanada because they can be purchased cheaply and with no evidence of where they came from. if people like you have your way we would all be victims and then you would have that to complain about too.

      • Stephen Barlow

        A huge percentage of Chi gang and NYC KILLING TOOLS are bought 250 miles away
        @ VA gun shows or 1000 miles away in Redneck Heaven. Georhole gia.

        Guys like you and I, real hunters. Who eat their kill and kill to eat…

        DON’T parade locked and loaded in Target.

      • Stephen Barlow

        No one takes all aspects into account. Too many fluctuating variables.But worldwide, less guns = less crime = less gun deaths.

        that is pretty much a given.

    • Bine646

      Police chief in detroit just creditted the drop in crime to citizens carrying weapons.

      • biloki

        Saying it doesn’t make it true.

      • Bine646

        Then refute it w facts

      • biloki

        Try proving his statement. There is no proof.

      • Charles Vincent

        That’s easy enough see the link.

        http://www DOT detroitmi DOT gov/DepartmentsandAgencies/PoliceDepartment/CrimeStatistics DOT aspx

      • Stephen Barlow

        Humn… so LESS police that LA per Capita = less gun crime. And More cops per capita like in NYC = more killer cops!!!

      • Stephen Barlow

        Let’s talk about FLorida and the SYG laws that get people KILLED (before leaving the scene and gobbling pizza in celebration of gun ‘rights’).

        That is a more realistic world view of REAL American life.

        The population of high crime areas of Chicago and detroit are less than .3% of America. In statistics, that’s known as an ANOMALY! The ones with GUNS are about 2% of that!

      • Bine646

        Lets see- chicago- many strict guns laws= murder capital of usa. Detroit- police force working half days w citizens protecting themselves= drop in crime rate.

        You see the 80 yrold who protected his home in Cali. He’s the generation of WW2. You sir are a sally

      • Stephen Barlow

        Good ol’ RED politics in action. Allowing Americans to go WITHOUT paramilitary support dollars jn Detroit just to make Negros Maximus look bad.

        That’s Latin for Obama.

      • booley

        So the part of the conversation where it was shown Chicago isn’t’ quite the murder capital it ha sheen portrayed as.. just skipped over that, didn’t you?

      • Charles Vincent

        Lets talk about Chicago’s firearms homicide rate

        In 2011 Chicago’s number of homicides by fire arm was 362. The total murders were 433.

        that with the total homicides for the whole state of Illinois at 452,
        377 of those were from firearms. So the City of Chicago was responsible
        for 362 of the 377 the firearms homicides for the whole state and was
        433 of the 452 total homicides for the whole state.

        FBI table 20
        http://www DOT fbi DOT gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2011/crime-in-the-u.s.-2011/tables/table-20

        report on Chicago

        https://portal DOT chicagopolice DOT org/portal/page/portal/ClearPath/News/Statistical%20Reports/Murder%20Reports/MA11 DOT pdfOne little addendum to the data, Illinois under reported in 2011 Illinois3
        “3 Limited supplemental homicide data were received”.

      • Bine646

        DC just overturned gun ban- you mad? How mad?

      • Stephen Barlow

        There choices, why should I be mad?

        I just like poking fun at cripples and the retarded. Which explains why you are my favorite punching bag.

      • Bine646

        Assuming alot huh

      • Stephen Barlow

        I have known you along time.

      • Bine646

        Whatever you say troll

      • Stephen Barlow

        I thought it was the exodus of citizens from Michigan?

  • Stephen Barlow

    Why would anyone NOT HUNTING HUMANS need:

    “In the United States “assault weapons” are usually defined in legislation as semi-automatic firearms that have certain features generally associated with military firearms, including assault rifles. The 1994 Federal Assault Weapons Ban, which expired on September 13, 2004, codified the definition of an assault weapon. It defined the rifle type of assault weapon as a semiautomatic firearm with the ability to accept a detachable magazine and two or more of the following:
    a folding or telescoping stock
    a pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon
    a bayonet mount
    a flash suppressor or threaded barrel designed to accommodate a flash suppressor
    a grenade launcher”


    • Charles Vincent

      “a folding or telescoping stock
      a pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon
      a bayonet mount
      a flash suppressor or threaded barrel designed to accommodate a flash suppressor”

      None of the things you listed make a weapon more lethal.

      “”In the United States “assault weapons” are usually defined in
      legislation as semi-automatic firearms that have certain features
      generally associated with military firearms, including assault rifles.
      The 1994 Federal Assault Weapons Ban, which expired on September 13, 2004, codified the definition of an assault weapon. It defined the rifletype of assault weapon as a semiautomatic firearm with the ability to accept a detachable magazine and two or more of the list above.”

      “a grenade launcher”

      good luck getting one with out a lot of money and even better luck finding grenades for it and even then the only type you will find are smoke since the other types are illegal to own.

      This is a bunch of horse shit cooked up by retards that don’t know anything about firearms.

      The actual definition is far different;

      assault rifle noun (Concise Encyclopedia)

      Military firearm that is chambered for ammunition of reduced size or propellant charge and has the capacity to switch between semiautomatic and fully automatic fire. Light and portable, yet able to deliver a high volume of fire with reasonable accuracy at modern combat ranges of 1,000–1,600 ft (300–500 m), assault rifles have become the standard infantry weapon of modern armies. Their ease of handling makes them ideal for mobile assault troops crowded into personnel carriers or helicopters, as well as for guerrilla fighters engaged in jungle or urban warfare. Widely used assault rifles are the U.S. M16, the Soviet Kalashnikov (the AK-47 and modernized versions), the Belgian FAL and FNC, and the German G3.

      • Stephen Barlow

        Oh sh*t! My stalker’s Back!!

  • Eg Kbbs

    Can’t post links here. But CDC keeps stats on gun violence and the CityLab website did an analysis they titled “The Geography of Gun Violence in Cities and Metros”. Looking at the data for cities on a per capita basis, Chicago doesn’t even make the top 10 for large metro areas.

    Other findings were along the lines of what you cite – gun violence correlates positively with poverty; decreases in areas with strong limits on firearms; etc.

    • Stephen Barlow

      Bottom line, worldwide, LESS guns = LESS crime = LESS GUN DEATHS IN ALL CATEGORIES. not only recently but over time

  • booley

    Of course anything make it easier for people in general to get guns quickly and with little to no lasting paper trail also allows would be murderers to do the same.

    But that doesn’t matter you see since the idea is we have lots and lots of random people with guns, then when some random bad guy decides he wants to kill random people, hopefully there will be a random good guy with a gun in that exact same random time and random location to (hopefully again ) have the presence of mind to shoot said random bad guy without being shot himself or also shooting some random bystander.. all before the cops show up since they won’t be able to tell one random person with a gun from another.

    Surely that plan beats trying to determine ways to curb gun violence before the shooting begins and trying to find a balance between the right to have a gun and the right to not be surrounded by armed idiots.

  • Charles Vincent

    Wow monkeyed numbers with no link to the base data an calculations used did they include suicides in the number?

    • Stephen Barlow

      Monkey#’s Great new handle Chuck!

  • Charles Vincent

    “Often they’ll tout Chicago, and its gun violence, as the “example” of what
    happens when “liberals pass their strict regulations on guns.” This, of
    course, is a ridiculous comparison because one city doesn’t prove
    anything. The best way to look at gun violence is to take each state and
    compare the gun violence (per 100,000 people) to really paint a picture
    as to where gun violence is really a problem.”

    Lets talk about Chicago’s firearms homicide rate

    In 2011 Chicago’s number of homicides by fire arm was 362. The total murders were 433.

    Compare that with the total homicides for the whole state of Illinois at 452 , 377 of those were from fire arms. So the City of Chicago was responsible for 362 of the 377 the firearms homicides for the whole state and was 433 of the 452 total homicides for the whole state

    FBI table 20
    http://www DOT fbi DOT gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2011/crime-in-the-u.s.-2011/tables/table-20

    report on Chicago

    https://portal DOT chicagopolice DOT org/portal/page/portal/ClearPath/News/Statistical%20Reports/Murder%20Reports/MA11 DOT pdf

    You Mr. Clifton are a rabid mouthbreather and you twist and misrepresent data to suit your ideological view.

    “So, let’s do just that. Here are the top 10 states with the most gun homicides per 100,000 people”

    Ah yes these statistics include suicide Which are not homicides way to fluff your bogus numbers.

    Your own link to data
    http://247wallst DOT com/special-report/2014/06/26/231958/4/

    I feel sorry for the people here you dupe, and its no wonder the left is clueless about guns with people like you writing trash like this Allen.

    • Sandy Greer

      Hm. Interesting. I didn’t know most gun deaths (near 2/3) were suicides. And gotta say – If I’m to be murdered – I’d rather be shot (than stabbed, bludgeoned, strangled, etc)

      Also, it’s somewhat ‘comforting’ (clearly, not the right word, but all I can think of at the moment) to know that (as a gun owner) if I’m ever so inclined – I have the means, at my disposal.

      • Stephen Barlow

        He didn’t mention the suicide by gun rate. Which varies year to year upon who is passing tax laws in DC.

    • Stephen Barlow

      Thank you for being semi honest for once. Give My best to you mother. Just don’t let your sister post the pics on the web.

  • Joe

    So where is Texas in all this? Enough said!

  • Noel Kerns

    Well said, Allen!

  • n mcconnell

    it really is too bad that the foregoing passes for intelligent commentary. i do not own any guns, nor am i a republican, but i am religious. however, unlike jim jones, i have no experience with religion ‘controlling’ the masses. people with consciences tend to follow the rules of society, whether they are religious or not, and if any of you knew anyone who was actually religious, you would know that religion can, in no way, be ascribed to inferior intellect. nor is it detrimental to the development of intellect or the pursuit of education. of course, education is correlated with greater income, but poverty and intelligence are not mutually exclusive. if so, then nelson mandella, gandhi, confucious, buddha, the dalai lama, and other heroes of gun-hating liberals must be considered as intellectually inferior. of course, it will do no good to say such a thing, but intelligence is not the exclusive domain of any one political affiliation, even though almost everyone who has commented on this article claims that their side is the only one with intelligent followers. most comments do not reflect an intelligent, thoughtful debate about gun ownership, but they do sound like preschool children having temper tantrums, and screaming lame cliche insults at each other. if no one has anything productive to say, why say it? does anyone think that their mindless repetition of standard insults is likely to win others over to their position? also, a person’s ability to type, or even spell correctly, has nothing to do with their ability to reason, think logically, or reach sound decisions. several members of my family struggle with dyslexia, but it has no bearing on their intelligence. it seems that most commentors really just need to grow up, and try thinking before they say anything. now, regarding this article, i do not see the validity of the author’s opinion that republicans want, either a) the impoverished (or anyone else) to buy guns or b) that gun ownership contributes to poverty. republicans are simply seeking to retain the RIGHT to bear arms. having the right to do something does not automatically ensure that a person will actually exercise that right, otherwise voter turn out in every election, from presidential campaigns to school board trustees would be 100%. i agree with his opinion that the best way to end violence is to reduce poverty, but that goes for all forms of violence, not just gun violence. the author also fails to mention the ratio of gun homicides to non-gun homicides, thereby implying that virtually all murder will be eradicated with the abolition of the right to gun ownership. by using the words ‘violence’ and ‘homicide’ interchangeably, the author also suggests that somehow, a decrease in the number of guns in society will result in the decrease all forms of violence– sexual assaults, knife violence, physical battery– whether or not guns are typically used in those crimes. he does not mention it, but there are other statistics showing that the majority of murders in the US are committed without the use of firearms. and, since he really emphasizes that the states he mentions have lower average incomes, and high gun ownership, implying that only impoverished, uneducated people have firearms, i would like to know what the statistics are regarding the rich and educated, versus gun ownership. he accuses supporters of the right to own guns, of trying to manipulate the facts so that more people will be swayed by their arguments, but he is every bit as guilty of manipulation as anyone else, and by condemning them for what he claims is dishonesty, he implies that he is completely truthful and trustworthy– even after he prints only the data that supports his opinion and withholds any that would weaken his argument. i realize that his forum is largely in the form of ‘preaching to the choir’, but that doesn’t make it any less deceptive.

    • Stephen Barlow

      WOW. I gotta say, that is one of the most OVERLY EDUCATED BEYOND YOUR INTELLIGENCE arguments i have EVER run across.

      SO you are NOT a Catholic!!!!!!

      So, to you, all people of conscience are religious and you guarantee that blind faith and obedience to a creed is the only sign of SUPERIOR INTELLIGENCE, then it follows that all REPUBLICANS are of inferior intellect as they follow no creed blindly, but with purpose and intent.

  • thomasbone63

    These poor states for the most part are illiterate and they all back people who holds them back. They vote for people who are anti women, anti health car, anti social security, anti medicare/medicaid, anti education, anti infrastructure, anti immigration, anti food stamps, anti cost of living increase. The article above is great and informative, something i will keep when the gun nuts talk about the crime in Chicago.

  • dirtsurfr

    I got it!! Give everyone in the poor States a gun and open a season on Republicans. Problem solved!
    Gun control is people control.
    Swift and deadly justice for shooters done at the crime scene.
    Caining for first time offenders of crimes to the public and no crime if there’s no Victim. And legalize Marijuana it will calm the masses and open our eyes.

  • SarcastiCynic

    i fail to see where they show the percentage of legal gun ownership in relation to the amount of homicides per 100k people……and considering the article was supposed to be “debunking” the idea that more guns equals less gun crime i would expect something to that fact……..instead they take the opportunity to shit on the republican party……..however there is plenty of data to support the idea that higher gun ownership does equal less gun crime……that is if you actually look for it objectively………not that i would expect forward proggressives to look at anything objectively……..

    • Stephen Barlow

      What does your GOD consider a “spiritually Acceptible” level of Gun Violence.

      Gotta ask. “Who Would Jesus SHOOT” if jerusalem were an open carry town in 33ABC? (It couldn’t be AD because if Jesus were armed, he would have been a SomaliPirate right?

  • Hunter Rose

    So where there is more poverty, there is more gun violence. No surprise. That, of course, has nothing to do with the number of guns, but with the level of hardship and desperation. What about New Hampshire where everyone gets a gun for their 12th birthday? (jk)
    Still, it’s ‘shall issue’ ‘open carry’ all over New Hampshire, but it didn’t make the list.
    No, the cause of gun violence is much like the cause of unwanted pregnancy: poverty and lack of education.

  • Ronald Morrison

    They are also the least educated states, something that seems in line with the way repugs control their “base”

  • Mischievious

    People need to stop buying shit they don’t need and start saving as much as they can every month. You want out of poverty? You gotta save your dollars!

    • Stephen Barlow

      You want out of poverty, sell METH or SMACK, bankroll a days pay and get on a bus to someplace decent.

  • ktrav

    The gun show loophole is why Chicago is awash with guns. Guns are bought at gun shows with no background checks or paperwork, brought into Chicago and sold on the street. The only way to slow that down is background checks at gun shows.

    • And the late Michael Jackson’s hometown is another reason. Indiana is a pipeline for gangs bringing guns to Chicago.

    • SarcastiCynic

      the gun show loophole is a myth….there are still background checks and paperwork filled out……..the guns that are on the streets of chicago are bought off the black market……..not gun shows……….that is just propaganda……

  • RayandFannie Esparza

    Shows the progress GOP Conservative have made after taking over from Democratic Conservatives..But even the lower economic voters will vote for the GOP again… Go Figure…After 100 ( ??? ) years Texas is not the state with the highest ( No.1 ) % of people working for Minimum wage or the state with the most people ( No.1 ) working for Minimum wage ..Still in TOP 10 though thanks to Oil and Gas production …Perry was praying for rain but God gave us oil and gas instead..Maybe we can drink oil as a last resource….Now .hoping for some change in Nov…


    well; im not the smartest “guy in da werl” but im willing 2 wager that more guns will help these poor states
    ummmmmm,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, how do U spell ” sarcasm”?

  • Ustad Morelock

    Not one, but two ads for ‘get your concealed carry permit’.

  • God the Holy Father

    If it were 2 thugged out black dudes carrying guns into Walmart do you think people would be coo with that? I doubt it!

  • Vladimir5j2

    Q. What does the gun lobby call a mass shooting? A. A fundraiser.

  • Dark Star

    I’m with you but unfortunately simple stats like these prove nothing either way. This is a fallacious & weak argument.

    If anything, it says to me that poorer locales are more likely to suffer from gun violence and tells me just about zero about gun laws because we don’t have meaningful gun laws ANYWHERE.

    Chicago is an equally poor example in the reverse. You can’t tell SHIT from a single data-point. And we know gangs got guns from outside the city, and the higher-court overturned the handgun ban a few years ago and gun violence went UP several points. So let them (fallaciously) point to Chicago and then you can, equally fallaciously, point right back and show it went up.

    VERY POOR reasoning all around. Please do NOT try to argue cause from statistics – you need studies that are much more controlled than simple stats to hope to draw any conclusions from the data.

    At best you can say, look here, there is a correlation between these two variables, let’s try to find out why…

    If you don’t do that your opponent is entirely right to reject your argument.

  • chris

    Notice something else about the top 10 States with the MOST Gun violence? Everyone of them has insanely stupid “Guns Not Allowed Here” zones. Now take Texas, for example, where signs every where tell people that Guns are not just allowed, they’re encouraged, and use of them, when necessary is also encouraged and accurate aim is appreciated!

    Texas has the LEAST number of Gun related problems of ALL of the States and nearly everyone there is packing!! What have we learned?

  • Camoleft

    Good work, Allen. Thanks for posting.

  • Carlos Sierz

    Yeah… we keep our guns to ensure that were armed against the government. That also happens to the intent of the Second amendment. It happens that only a small sliver of people care about your desire to shred that amendment, which is great for us.

    Common sense says that 18 deaths per 100,000 people is an acceptable number when considering the risks involved in not being armed against societal violence and governmental tarrant.

    Our goal is not to reduce the death toll to 0. That’s not how it works. It’s to keep the death toll within reason. Not to mention, assuming your statistics are accurate, your stats don’t show why or how they died by the gun. There are plenty of acceptable reasons why people get shot and die.

  • cravin moorehead

    Well, “educated one”, if you think that YOU’ owning 50 rifles, means ANYTHING when you’re confronted by the might of the United States Military, your education was a waste of time.

    Now, as for the “Second Amendment”, I feel that you SHOULD have the right to poses arms. And, those arms should be the arms that existed at the time that the Amendment was written. How’s THAT for sticking to the actual meaning of the Amendments?

    Get real, Rambo.

    When confronted by the actual might of the United States Government, the only thing that you would really have covered is your corps at the bottom of a grave.

    If you have actually served in the Army, you wouldn’t even suggest such a stupid thought.

    I’m a Vietnam vet.

    When we came back stateside, we didn’t have our sidearms and rifles in our possession, unless we took them from the armory for drill or to clean them.

    YOU should know THAT Fact.

    • Carlos Sierz

      That makes a lot of sense. So, the second amendment, a rule written as a principle to transcend time should only allow citizens to possess muskets.

      So you choose to disregard the principle, which is that it was written to allow citizens and states to arm themselves adequately against the federal government. Well, luckily for us, the Constitution is a contractual agreement between the U.S. Government and the people it governs and the wording doesnt make room for silly opinions like that.

      As for owning 50 rifles:

      I only two need a rifle and a handgun. However, if i did own 50 rifles, i would simply arm my neighbors and family members.

      Surprising coming from s Vietnam Veteran.