A Trumpster Friend Confronted Me for Criticizing Him, Really Didn’t Like My Response

It’s actually rare that someone I personally know who supports Donald Trump confronts me about something political, especially considering most of my Trump-backing friends know exactly how I feel about him and the Republican party.



Yet for some inexplicable reason on Thursday I received a message from one of these Trumpster friends of mine who felt the need to let me know that they weren’t overly happy with some of the things I’ve said about Trump or those who defend him:

You are so arrogant. You only see your side. No one else’s!

This was in response to me mocking a comment from a different Trump-backing friend of mine (though I didn’t single them out by name, just described them as a “Trump supporter” like I’m doing here) that I guess sent this particular friend over the edge.

Let’s just say, this was not the day for someone to call me out about Trump. Here was my response:

I’m arrogant? Why, because I know and believe in facts? Unlike political radicals, which most Trump supporters most definitely are, I’m not in this to “be right.” I care about facts, truth, science, history, and what’s real — not what I want to be real because I ignore all of those things. I don’t just make comments for the sake of saying something. Every single day I deal with political radicals, both liberal and conservative, probably around 70 hours a week. While I’m not going to pretend like I know everything, I damn sure know a lot more than many and I’m not going to say anything unless I’ve put some time, thought, and research into it.

I’ve communicated with thousands of Trump supporters since he launched his campaign and almost none of them every know anything factual — including you. I see the nonsense you post, but I don’t comment on it because I know there’s no point. Any source I use to debunk something you think is real you’ll call “fake news,” ignore completely, or make an excuse for Trump because facts don’t matter to Trump supporters. I mean real facts don’t — you all love “alternative facts.”

For a prime example of what I mean, look at this health care bullshit. For years Republicans said they would “repeal and replace Obamacare.” SEVEN YEARS! Now they have all the power they need to do exactly what they promised their voters they would do —  yet they haven’t. Why? Because in all of those years promising a “better health care plan,” they clearly never came up with a damn thing. They had to call off their first vote because in the Republican-controlled House of Representatives they couldn’t get “Trumpcare” passed.

This is the party that shut down the government trying to get rid of Obamacare — that never had a plan to replace it with had they been successful. They just said and did all of that to manipulate and fear-monger because as long as President Obama was in office they knew they would never have to actually back up their bold, yet ultimately empty, promises. However, they could manipulate people using that anti-Obamacare propaganda to work them up enough into an irrational frenzy that any and all common sense would fly right out of the window.

Same thing with that stupid damn wall. Mexico will never pay for it, and Trump knew that from the very beginning. But he kept pushing that idiocy because he knew his supporters were dumb enough to believe him. See, you call people like myself “arrogant,” while ignoring the glaring fact that the guy who you voted for last November blatantly treats the people who supported him like mindless sheep who’ll believe anything he says. And I don’t blame him, because that’s a fairly accurate assessment for most.

Oh, and remember when he was going to prosecute Hillary Clinton? Funny, practically right after he was declared the “winner” he said he wasn’t going to. Even though he knew all those times he said she belonged in jail, and if elected he would be about “law and order” by appointing a special prosecutor to go after her, much like his promise to make Mexico pay for his wall, he knew all he had to do was mention her name and like a shepherd leading his flock of sheep — they’d respond exactly how he wanted.

Lock her up! Lock her up! Lock her.. oh, never mind.

Question: What happened to bashing Clinton because he claimed she was a shill for Wall Street because she gave a couple of paid speeches for Goldman Sachs? You remember that? I certainly know I do.

Fun Fact: He has seven members of his administration who have ties to Goldman Sachs. The top two people at the U.S. Department of the Treasury are former Goldman Sachs executives. And those are just the people from Goldman Sachs, not the rest of the millionaires and billionaires he brought on board. If Clinton was unethical and a Wall Street sellout as Trump claimed she was for giving a couple of paid speeches to Goldman Sachs, then what do you call the person who stacks his cabinet with several individuals who’ve worked for Goldman Sachs?

His tax returns? Not only did he criticize Mitt Romney for being rather shady about releasing his in 2012, he spent months promising to release his — yet never will. Though it’s not just that he’s clearly never going to release his tax returns, but that he’s continually lied about why he won’t.

Meanwhile, Trump supporters like yourself would be losing your damn minds if Clinton had been elected without releasing hers. Though you all will gladly make excuses for him, even though the IRS has said there’s no reason he couldn’t release his returns even while being audited because, well, TRUMP!

Then there was all those times he called the monthly jobs reports “fake” and the unemployment rate “phony.” Funny, for two-straight months now, his administration has bragged about those numbers — even though his policies have had absolutely nothing to do with them. It’s interesting how suddenly they’re not so fake and phony, isn’t it? Yeah, you might actually chuckle at that, but he was dead serious when he called these numbers under Obama “fake.” It’s like I say, you can tell how much respect someone has for you by how often they lie and how blatant those lies are.

A few weeks ago he literally said, “Nobody knew health care could be so complicated.” Are you kidding me? Every Democrat and rational person in this country knew how difficult fixing our health care system would be. They knew how complicated it was and how full of crap his and the rest of the GOP’s promises were for a “law that provides cheaper, better coverage.”

Another question, whatever happened to that whole “millions of people who voted illegally” nonsense? Here we are, months later, yet he still hasn’t provided a shred of proof that the biggest voting scandal in our nation’s history took place. Isn’t it odd for a president, especially one who declared himself a man of “law and order,” to claim there was unprecedented voter fraud in the country of which he’s the leader, yet he doesn’t seem too concerned about investigating it? One would think that the president, and congressional Republicans who’ve spent years saying voter ID laws are crucial to address the “problem of voter fraud,” would want to know how millions of people voted illegally and just how many currently “elected” officials “won” because of what would be one of the biggest scandals in American political history. Wouldn’t you think? You know, if it were true?

I’m sorry, are my facts, direct quotes from Trump, and simple common sense being a little “too arrogant”? Maybe I should just brag about how everything I do is the best, how nobody will ever be as good for (fill in the group/demographic) as I will be, never take the blame for anything wrong I do, and personally attack others who criticize me. Would that make me more humble?

Within about a minute the icon on the messenger indicated that they had read my response — so I waited.

After everything I had just said, this was the only response I received:

I’m not responding to that because you choose not to listen to anyone, your mind is made up.

That was it. I asked them what, exactly, did I say that was wrong, but they never responded.

Was I too harsh? Maybe. Feel free to hit me up on Twitter or Facebook and let me know what you think.




Allen Clifton

Allen Clifton is a native Texan who now lives in the Austin area. He has a degree in Political Science from Sam Houston State University. Allen is a co-founder of Forward Progressives and creator of the popular Right Off A Cliff column and Facebook page. Be sure to follow Allen on Twitter and Facebook, and subscribe to his channel on YouTube as well.

Comments

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  • Kathleen

    It’s increasingly harder to argue the merits of Trump or defend one’s support of Trump. It’s best to say nothing except “I’m not responding because . . . whatever. Introspection is hard.

  • John Alfano

    You can’t have a war of wits with people who are obviously unarmed.

    • Chris Grubb

      To be fair, I don’t see any indications that the author made any concessions or offered a chance for the other guy to present his case. Not saying that the Trump supporter has any better arguments, but he is right in a way: if we really want to convince people to change their minds, we’re going to have swallow our pride and look for points of common ground instead of starting from a position in which they are all idiots. Rants like these are cathartic, but unlikely to achieve results. Basic psychology, really.
      https://www.brainpickings.org/2014/03/28/daniel-dennett-rapoport-rules-criticism/

      • Marcellus Bodi

        Chris Grubb.Where was there any rants in what he had to say?What you are saying is that a person that don’t accept facts to get them to change their beliefs you do what Mr Brain Doctor?I can’t wait to see a response to this.

      • Chris Grubb

        I think the term rant is appropriate insofar as it consisted of a litany of arguments against Trump and was evident written during a fit of pique. You don’t have to call it that if you don’t want to. I’ve certainly had my fair share of rants, but I’m always careful to separate my attacks on the POTUS from the person I’m talking to.

        http://aaagmnrs.livejournal.com/4171.html

      • Jonetta Fetchko

        I wouldn’t be calling anyone brain doctor when you can’t even write proper English.

      • PI

        I’m not being obtuse; what does this mean? “What you are saying is that a person that don’t accept facts to get them to change their beliefs you do what Mr Brain Doctor?”

      • HairyEyedWordBombThrower

        “Reality has a *strong* liberal bias” — Stephen Colbert

        If the Trumpster can’t stand reality, that’s not our problem.

      • marysrn

        It IS our problem when so MANY of them vote, and vote “wrong”!

      • Ruth

        Another ha-ha worthy comment….

      • John Masters

        You can’t reason a person out of a position they didn’t reason themselves into in the first place. (author not me but unknown) And that’s the problem with trying to find common ground. It’s like the flat Earth argument. Besides the fact that we both live on the Earth, I don’t what common ground you come to to being a discussion.

        You bring facts and their citations to the discussion, and in the end, I always finally get a, “I don’t care,” response. You can’t have a realistic discussion with someone who doesn’t care about reality. I understand and appreciate where you are coming from, but the other party to the discussion has to be willing to be intellectual honest for any conversation to hold up.

      • Karinjsdalazar

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      • Tom Caudron

        To be really fair, the other guy did have a chance to present his case. All he had to do was type it and post it. Stewart even asked his friend, and I quote, “what, exactly, did I say that was wrong?”

      • Chris Grubb

        @tomcaudron:disqus @BJohnMasters:disqus

        All of you are right, of course, that the Trump supporter had a *chance* to make his case. Nobody was holding him back from the keyboard. But what’s the point of him trying if the OP Allen has already made it clear that compromise was not an option?

        If I were Allen, and I really wanted the Trump supporter to re-examine his views, I would have started off by conceding something like: “I don’t think the fact that you voted for Trump makes you a racist/sexist/Islamophobe; however, I do think X policy disproportionately hurts Y, and this is my reasoning.” Or: “You must have had a pretty good reason for voting for Trump despite his obvious character flaws. What is it about Trump that attracted you to his message?”

        In my experience, there’s a lot of angry Trump supporters out there who aren’t really interested in arguing, because
        they’re tired of being stereotyped as rednecks/hillbillies/rubes/whatever. Most of them, however, are actually perfectly good people. They would never personally discriminate against somebody on the basis of their skin color or religion, and they certainly don’t want to live under a dictatorship. They may been misled by partisan media, or they may be unfamiliar with the stories of the minorities who
        are threatened by Trump’s policies, or they may have gotten an incorrect impression of liberals based on some postings they’ve read on the internet.

        I’m not saying that anything the author wrote is factually wrong. Just that starting off the conversation with a respectful tone can go a long way toward achieving dialogue. If we don’t learn to find common ground, it doesn’t even matter if we have the better arguments. The mere act of making concessions will do more to change their minds than a million facts if those facts can’t bring them to the negotiating table.

        I know it’s unfair that some people feel they have the right to be rude and dismissive and we have to play nice, but sometimes we just need to be the better people.

      • Jonas Planck

        When the only case someone ever presents is “I know you are but what am I?” Then it becomes very difficult to explain to them that you DID hear them say it and they are wrong about it, because the only response you will ever get from them is that exact same thing, re-phrased.

        “I understand your concerns, but that simply isn’t true…”
        Yes it is true! You’re the one who is wrong!
        “no, look, here’s a measured explanation of why that is wrong, taken on a point-by-point basis so I can explain to you exactly why…”
        SHUT UP! YOU’RE LYING! You’re not listening to me!
        “I AM listening to you, and I’m trying to explain that you’re mistaken about…”
        No YOU’RE the one who is mistaken! I’m not mistaken, you’re just stupid and evil! You hate goodness and truth and freedom!
        “No, I don’t. Where did you get such a ridiculous idea? That doesn’t even make sense…”
        No YOU’RE the one who has ridiculous ideas that don’t make sense! And you kill babies!
        “I’ve never killed any babies in my life, what the hell are you talking about?”
        You’re not listening! I said YOU KILL BABIES! It’s true!
        “I do not kill babies.”
        LIAR! YOU KILLED MILLIONS OF BABIES! I’m the one who cares about life and doesn’t kill babies! Why won’t you listen?

        And so on, and so forth…

      • Jonas Planck

        And before some Trumpist comes along and says, “That’s what liberals do, we don’t act like that,” let me just remind you that if you say such a thing, you will PROVE ME RIGHT.

      • Ruth

        It never ceases..

    • Ellensnickles

      Google is paying 97$ per hour! Work for few hours & have longer with friends and family! !dq153c:
      On tuesday I got a great new Land Rover Range Rover from having earned $8752 this last four weeks.. Its the most-financialy rewarding I’ve had.. It sounds unbelievable but you wont forgive yourself if you don’t check it
      !dq153c:
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    • Pingy

      Nor can you have a war of wits with a person who obviously has only a double digit IQ, as in Allen’s friend.

      • Ruth

        Again, ha-ha!

    • Jonas Planck

      That’s the problem, they know that too, which is why they refuse to have a war of wits at all. They’ve discovered a kind of mental Jiu-Jitsu that turns an opponent’s intellect against them… to fight it successfully, you have to embrace both intellect AND trollcraft at the same time, otherwise they’ll drive you batty with their contortions of reason and absurd belief systems. The trick is not to take yourself seriously, to put aside belief and use conjecture instead. Take their premise and run with it, right into the arms of the most absurd possible conclusions it leads to, and then roll that train right back around to where it started. If you can evade their prejudices while you do that, you have a chance of opening their eyes, or rather, tricking them into opening their eyes THEMSELVES, because that’s the only way you can ever get anybody to open their eyes.

      Remember, if they’re willing to vote for a guy who routinely gives TWO opposite conflicting answers to every question, then you already have a very powerful cognitive weapon at your disposal. Work those blind spots. Get them to think outside their box, and they’ll start having to use parts of their brains that they forgot they had. That’s the key.

      • Ruth

        Why should they have to be taught to be open minded to the truth?

  • RL K

    Fantastic! I say the same things to people/relatives I know but it’s exhausting, so I’ve given up on them. Not going to waste my time or health on them. They made their bed, they can LIE in it. But I appreciate you consolidating it all, when, on those days when you worry that being quiet is being complicit and “normalizing” all this — it helps to see it all written out.

  • Janet Held

    Fantastic Allen!

  • Nick

    Omg Obama wire tapped Trump, another crazy tweet, and some people are still looking for the wires. I have a cousin who read a fake news article about how Hillary gave a secret signal to have Scalia killed, she has a PhD, her comment was if this is true? Do I need to say more? The crazies who’ve been on the side lines have found their nut and its Donald Trump.

    • Clive Johnson

      I really think the conservative movement has constructed for itself a safety zone, using radio, TV, books, magazines, and websites, where it can escape the cognitive dissonance of having their beliefs challenged, and have their contrary-to-reality beliefs reinforced. In a way such a media infrastructure is likely a necessity if you’re going to be spouting claims such as the earth being less than 10,000 years old, or that climate change is a vast hoax, or that liberals are somehow destroying America–beliefs that because of their sharp contradiction to everything they might hear from mainstream sources, need constant reinforcement.

      What does your friend have their PhD in, if I might ask?

      • Nick

        Of all things counseling, she’s had 2 failed marriages as is so what bitter to help people who she believes get hand outs. I tell her that there are millionaires on the liberal side who believe in helping thy neighbor, and also she’s overly religious, she fits the pattern.

    • Mary Alice Strzalka

      Nick – simple answer to your friend. “No, it is not true.” As with the lies, if you tell the truth often enough, people will nfinally start tobelieve it. The problem is we (democrats) don’t respond correctly to the lies. We need to simply, calmly, say “NO, that is not true, that is a lie.” This will eventually bring back the viceral childhood haunt of their mothers punishing them for lieing.

      • Nick

        I absolutely agree. Stop playing around and just say it Mr trump your lying.

    • JAM661

      Right Clinton gave the signal and Scalia died of a heart attack. Make sense to me.. HAHA!!!

  • Chris Grubb

    To be fair, I don’t see any indications that the author made any concessions or offered a chance for the other guy to present his case. Not saying that the Trump supporter has any better arguments, but he is right in a way: if we really want to convince people to change their minds, we’re going to have swallow our pride and look for points of common ground instead of starting from a position in which they are all idiots. Rants like these are cathartic, but unlikely to achieve results. Basic psychology, really.

    • DCJensen

      If you did not see it, you are one of them.

      >After everything I had just said, this was the only response I received:

      >>I’m not responding to that because you choose not to listen to anyone, your mind is made up.

      >That was it. I asked them what, exactly, did I say that was wrong, but they never responded.

      He gave him a chance, and the person didn’t bother.

    • scubus

      What chance did you want to see? He presented facts, which really don’t allow for concessions.

  • FAEN

    Typical Cheeto voter response.

  • agr8wrld

    How many years did it take for them to “get a clue” about the truth on Iraq? They can’t grasp the truth because they don’t want to grasp the truth. Until that day, they’ll accept every lie that spews out of his mouth and that’s a whole lot of lies. smh

  • Benjamin Edge

    There are still idiots who believe “Pizzagate” was real, despite Breitbart apologizing to the restaurant owner and admitting that the story was fake. But Breitbart only did so under threat of being sued. How do you find common ground, or reason with that?

    • Todd20036

      It’s like trying to find common ground with Nazis. The answer is, you don’t. It’s impossible

  • cleos_mom

    I’m guessing your response was never read.

  • Clive Johnson

    Excellent post, one that puts on center stage a profound human problem that spans the globe–bias and lack of critical thinking skills. Yet, progressivism in the US hasn’t prioritized solving the problem of mass lack of critical thinking skills. If we could “fix” the curriculum to focus on critical thinking, undo dogmatic thought patterns, and substantially increase philosophical literacy, we could see the evaporation of the hard right within a generation. We could put organized conservatism in its present form to rest.

    If you’re curious about the topic of dogmatism and its harms, check out, for example, How Dogmatic Beliefs Harm Creativity and Higher-Level Thinking, by Don Ambrose and Robert Sternberg.

    • bobn2010

      To be fair, Clive, I don’t believe this is purely a conservative thought pattern. Liberals have their own dogma. For example, I’ve often argued with my liberal, Whole-Foods-shopping friends that there is no proof of health benefits from organic foods. And I’ve had some say to me outright, “there’s no point in sending me articles and studies because I’m not going to change my mind!”

      Let’s stop pretending that conservatives have cornered the market on irrational thought.

      • scubus

        Until those liberals who go to Whole Foods try and force all of us to go to whole foods, their irrationality is of no concern to me.

        And of course, there is no proof that there are no health benefits from organic foods either. But that is another line of discussion. There is a difference between articles based on opinion and those based on facts that can be verified. The issue time and again is that Trump supporters in particular ignore and deny facts.

      • Clive Johnson

        I agree that irrationalism is not the sole province of conservatism. But at the moment it strikes me as doing far and away the greatest damage.

  • Taylor Harrell

    You can’t fight against a stupid conservative.

  • Elizabeth Burton

    I long ago adopted a rule when talking to both Trump and Clinton cultists: I never engage in a battle of facts with an unarmed opponent.

  • Jonas Planck

    I didn’t listen, because people who don’t listen shouldn’t be listened to.

    And that sums it all up right there. Infinite variations on the theme of blatantly rubbing one’s own obvious hypocrisy in other people’s faces as a power play. Gaslighting is the ONLY principle they truly value. It comes in many forms:

    “We need to outlaw liberals’ freedom of speech because liberals don’t believe in free speech like we do!”

    “After I told you what my beliefs are, you just ASSUME that you know my beliefs!”

    “Black people are the KKK, because democrats or something!”

    “You’re just mad about us starting a war because you wanted that war-mongering Hillary to win!”

    “People who punch Nazis are the REAL Nazis!”

    “Feelings don’t matter! Now respect my feelings!”

    “I take delight in your suffering, because YOU’RE the one who takes delight in other people’s suffering!”

    “All you stupid moron idiot Marxists do is call people names!”

    Do they really think people don’t notice this stuff? Or are they so stupid that they themselves don’t even realize that they’re doing it? It’s got to be deliberate, there’s no way this degree of hypocrisy should be so prevalent if it’s merely accidental, even if you assume that they’re consuming a steady diet of propaganda from only right wing sources that encourage this kind of cognitive absurdity. They HAVE to know they’re doing it.

  • Ginny March

    Well said. Trump supporters are hard to reason with.

  • bobn2010

    A conservative friend of mine likes to ask, “If you liberals are so smart, why do you keep losing?”

    It’s a question I often ask myself. Why do supposedly smart, educated people like Allen Clifton continue to treat conservatives with arrogance and condescension, when study after study has shown that condescending treatment by liberals is what MOTIVATES Trump supporters?

    Could it be that some people care less about science, and less about changing the political agenda in this country, than they do about stroking their own egos?

    I think Allen’s friend isn’t dumb at all. He’s stating a clear and simple fact: “You are so arrogant. You only see your side. No one else’s!”

    As long as the focus of liberals is on bashing conservatives (with blog posts like this one), we will continue to lose elections. But oh, we can all feel good about how smart we are!

  • Bonta-kun

    Mr Clifton! MR CLIFTON!

    Mr Clifton, SIR, we NEED you to put the flamethrower DOWN!

  • Elizabeth Bates

    A coworker and I was told at a Starbucks, if you do not support Trump, you will not go to heaven. God only allow Trump Supporters into heaven. Any Christians not supporting Trump will go to hell. Both of us are Atheist. We realize, it useless to argue with an idiot!

  • T Jason Wuthrich

    IMO, anyone who votes Republican solely because they despise liberals has no right to call themselves patriots. If our forefathers were okay with this level of conservatism, they would never have left England.

  • Just wonderin’

    You can’t argue with a Trump pumpkin.

  • Emma Goff

    Responses where you use one’s own words to make your point are favorites of mine! It highly likely that after reading your first point he stopped reading and did not read the rest for if he had, I am sure if would have been followed by, “but Obama” or “what about Hillary?” Its unfortunate that there are so many that have been “gas lighted” by him and the GOP and with no signs of the gas going out!

  • Jim

    What exactly was your friends side, anyway?

  • Reader

    Wonder if conservatives learned about any of these things in school?

    Since So many conservatives blame Liberals for the countries and their woes – Out of curiosity I googled “what can we thank democrats for”: This is what I found – The GI Bill, Endangered Species Act (because of this our national symbol the Bald Eagle is flying again), Environmental Laws (the environment has gotten much better in the last 30 years, most rivers and lakes are clean again due to anti-pollution laws, frequent smog days are a thing of the past in most big cities) Space Program (JFK –D challenged us to make it to the moon. Under him and Johnston –D the space program took, numerous benefits to American industry and people’s standard of living and National Pride. ( Since you are reading this on a computer thank the space program and liberals who got it going. ), Peace Corps, Americorps (a civil society program supported by the U>S> federal goven., foundations, corporations, and other donors engaging adults in public service work with goal of “helping others and meeting critical needs in the community.)Civil Rights movement, Earned Income Tax credit, family and medical leave act, consumer product safety act, Freedom of Information Act, Women’s right to control their reproductive future, Allowing citizens to view their own credit records, The Internet. Balancing the federal budget, The Brady Bill, Lobbying disclosure Act, Motor-voter Act, Voting rights Act, unemployment Insurance, Medicare/Medicaid, Food Stamp Act, Peace between Israel/Egypt, Peace between Israel/Jordon, Department of Education, Department of Energy, Department of Transportation, Department of Housing and Urban Development, Labor Laws ,1930’s ended child labor, gave us 40 hour work weeks, right of employees to collectively bargain , overtime pay, work place safety (conservatives fought tooth and nail against ending sweatshops and exploitation), Marshall Plan ( rebuilt Europe after WWII and is major reason communism never made it past East Berlin), Food Safety Laws, workplace safety Laws, Civilian Conservation Corps ( public work relief program that operated 1933 to 1942 for unemployed, unmarried men from relief families as part of the New Deal. Provided unskilled manual labor jobs related to the conservation and development of natural resources in rural lands owned by federal, state and local governments. To provide jobs for young men and relieve families who had difficulty finding jobs during Great Depression)Securities and Exchange Commission, Women’s right to vote, universal public Education, National weather service, Product Labeling Laws, truth in advertising, Morrell Land Grant (The reason nearly every state has large public universities. If you attended a school with a state name in it – then you were helped by liberalism), Rural Electrification, Bank Deposit Insurance (FDIC), Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, Public Broadcasting (did your children grow up watching Sesame Street?), Supporting the establishment of Israel, The United Nations, NATO, Interstate Highway system ( Proposed b Roosevelt (D) erected by Eisenhower (R).

    I am sure many conservatives use and appreciate most of these and have benefited from them. Then thank a liberal.

    To be fair I also googled – “What can we thank republicans for”

    I found an article by US News and World Report dated 2013 saying: this year Veterans Day will come 10 days after cuts in federal food aid demanded by House Republicans. Cuts mean 47 million hungry Americans including 1 million Veterans. I could find nothing like the list above. Try googling the question yourself if you don’t believe me. Google is not part of Main Stream Media.

  • Paul Davis

    It is tl;dr to them as well. Facts don’t work. What does work if you can keep their attention is the Socratic methods. Short questions to them. Not preaching. And when they deviate bring it back to them questioning themselves. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tw45yU6yh-E